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FullyFunctional

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car washer

car washer (1/8)

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  1. Sorry for postwhoring, but I had to WORD this. It's too bad that Clay's fans (at least a good percentage of them) can't be as gracious as Clay is.
  2. First of all, I love you KAndre! You are so deliciously eeevil! Secondly, BA HA HA HA!!! Clay is deliciously eeevil as well... Though his blog may not have any connection whatsoever to the tour DRA-MMMAAA, I'd like to think he's taking a jab.
  3. Hee! Yeah, that was mean wasn't it? Ok- point taken... Another thought I had. It occurs to me that some fans don't know how to enjoy their fandom any more. A minor annoyance, like a tour they are not crazy about becomes a MAJOR CATASTROPHE. A CD with sales they find disappointing is THE END OF CLAY'S CAREER AND IT'S OBVIOUS THE WORLD IS OUT TO GET HIM. We've always been a drama-filled fandom, but what has happened, I think, is that so many of the fans who were more balanced and level-headed have moved on and the balance has tipped more towards the panicking, angsting drama queens. So many of my "sane" fandom friends from the beginning have left the fandom- many because they couldn't deal with the drama any more. That's why I LOVE this place. It's my little spot of sanity.
  4. Double WORD. The folks who whine and complain the loudest often seem to be the ones who attend the most concerts and pay a fortune for broker seats in the front row. My evidence is only anecdotal, of course, but this is my perception. I, too, find the gagging and puking disrespectful to Clay, Ruben AND KLo. How would Clay fans feel if they visited a message board for the other two AI alumni involved and saw a bunch of folks gagging and puking over the idea of their idol touring with Clay? There would be much gnashing of teeth; I can tell you that! It doesn't bother me at all that some folks are not crazy about the tour idea. While I love all three artists and would love to see them all in concert, I can certainly understand that some don't think this tour is a very good idea. But I don't understand the intensity of some peoples' anguish and the weeping and wailing. If the tour sounds like a dud to you, why not just skip this one and wait for the next one? It's not a requirement to attend every single tour Clay has. Until Clay releases a new CD that is supported by his label, I don't see him as able to really carry a tour on his own right now. Unfortunately, he's not really gaining a ton of new fans at the moment, and there will be natural attrition in any fandom. While Ruben and Kim are probably not drawing huge crowds, they are drawing different crowds, and perhaps the nostalgic idea of AI2 redux will draw in some general AI fans, which may lead to Clay gaining some new fans. I am not a career strategist type- I have no interest in telling Clay how to run his career- but even I can see that it is crucial for Clay to build his fanbase back up. Until he gets that next CD out, and unless the CD sees significant label support, it can't hurt for him to tour with some other folks. Though I am a Clay fan first and foremost, it does bother me to see some attitudes of "Clay is too good to deign to tour with those also-rans, Ruben and Kim." It bothers me because Kim and Ruben are Clay's friends; at least that's the message Clay has given us thus far, and I hate to see fans trash Clay's friends. It also bothers me because I find it hypocritical. Can you just imagine how angry the fans would be if they read the same sentiment about Clay from Kim and Ruben fans? Do unto others, and all... If I were Clay and read the posts about this at the OFC, I would be deeply offended and would probably push the idea just out of spite. And add Carmen to the roster. :medium-smiley-070:
  5. OMG, that is enough to bring me right out of lurkdom! I've been out of town a lot this summer and am settling back in to work (though I'm obviously not working, no?) Wow. I'm glad to see someone addressing something that has bothered me for some time, and it's not even specifically about CAP. Why are some fans protected and sacred and cannot be publicly called out for bad behavior but others are fair game? Why didn't I get the memo with the list of fans I am permitted to trash on the web? Why is booing at other fans and constantly being a toxic online presence somehow less obnoxious or pernicious than interacting with Clay in the manner that Ethel does? I have actually asked for guidance from official sources about why it's okay to bash some fans and not others, but have never really been given a specific answer. In my opinion, it's either okay to talk about specific fans on message boards or it isn't. I have seen the most vile things written about Ethel, and my sense is that most of the vitriol is coming from a place of jealousy. Guess what? Clay likes Ethel better than he does most fans, and people need to #$#$ deal with it and suck it up and move on. The more people complain, the more attention I hope he gives her. These days, I'm almost hoping he makes love to her on stage in front of the loudest complainers and booers. So, I can't say that Fan X was being obnoxious and rude when she booed during a concert, or that Fan Y on my message board shouldn't have tried to sneak into Clay's hotel room, etc, etc, but I can say that Ethel is an annoying famewhore? Such inequity! Might Ethel want to tone down the antics in the middle of a concert? It's hard for me to say, as I don't remember ever being around her in a concert setting. I'd say that in general, if a fan is disrupting a concert, then perhaps she might want to be more respectful of those sitting around her. However, I can't really weigh in on this, as I've never sat near her at a concert. I think that in general, most of the complaints are really more about the fact that Clay gives her attention than they are about any specific thing she's done to disrupt a concert. If Ethel actually reads here, I hope she sees this. Ethel, you have nothing for which to apologize. You go on with your bad-ass self and enjoy Clay and your fandom. Don't let anyone bully you or make you feel like you need to apologize or back away. I have your back, girl.
  6. OK- I need an avatar. Clayzor- I am so sorry to hear about what happened to you as well. I know there must be others out there who could take their power back as well. I will fully admit that I allowed myself to be intimidated until I realized that their whole point was to intimidate. One thing I think helped is for couchtomato and Ansa to bring this topic to light. Cyber-bullying should never be tolerated or kept swept under the rug. I believe the secrecy, shame and silence gives the attackers more power than they would have otherwise. I also think that when people receive attacking PMs, they NEED to send them to the admins of those particular message boards. I have heard of so many people who have received nasty PMs and then won't do anything about them. One thing bullies need to know is that the moment I open that PM and read it, it's being copied and pasted. Heck, I'd be half inclined to post it openly on the board if it's bad enough and risk trout. *runs from couchtomato* cindilu2, I don't see our discussion here condoning rampant speculation of Clay's sexuality as much as it is speaking out against cyber-bullying and condemning what seems like draconian measures against people who don't deserve to have their pictures posted and their private lives disturbed. The point is that if the OC is annoying to one, one does not have to go there. I don't understand why some of the "fighting warriors for Clay" keep visiting a board they so revile, but then again, I don't understand the urge of those same "warriors" to continue feeding at the trough of hate at the hate blogs either. Thanks for the support, couchtomato.
  7. "Pour Some Sugar On Me"? "Lick it Up"? "Don't Fall on Me"? This is too much fun... *waves to YSRN, LdyJocelyn, jmh, Sally and JennaZ*
  8. OMG, so much word to go around. First of all, I need a wedding dress because I am going to spirit Ansa, couchtomato and KAndre off (along with some others here) for a good old fashioned mass wedding. WORD. If a bunch of people want a space of their own to have a kind of "niche" fandom, so be it. I am not condoning the behavior of any individual members who might create "mischief" elsewhere, but I don't care if someone wants to create a board where they sit around and call Clay gay, or a board where people fantasize about knitting with Clay, or a board for Amish Clay Lovers, or whatever, I don't have a problem with it. What I do have a problem with are people who gather for the sole purpose of carrying on witch hunts against other fans and engaging in what I consider to be borderline illegal. I don't think that kind of speculation belongs on the OFC, but what someone does on their own board is not my concern until they bring it into my face. And yes, the occasional OC member does make innuendos at the OFC and try to rile people up, but I just scroll past them. Yes, that's immature behavior. No, I don't have to play in to the immature behavior, give the person what they want, and overreact. I'll come right out and say that I was one of the people who was cyber-bullied by self-styled "warriors for Clay". I am posting under an alter now, and I don't really give a crap if anyone knows who I am (ebird), but the experience pretty much soured me on the fandom as a whole for months. I pretty much left until I finally decided that I wasn't going to let myself be intimidated by some overinvested people who thought they were engaging in some silly epic battle between good and evil. It's their problem, not mine. I want to thank you, couchtomato, for acknowledging one of the proverbial elephants in the fandom room. I consider these people to be no different than the "haters" on the Clay hate blogs. The targets are different, but the vileness is the same. It's refreshing to hear people openly and finally speaking up about what has been going on behind the scenes. People have received nasty PMs that have told them to leave the fandom. People have had their pictures posted while other people make snide comments about their physical appearance. People have been investigated; their private lives exposed. I don't know if these people are still active now, but it certainly was a feeding frenzy at one time. When you try to explain this entire situation to a total stranger outside the fandom, the reaction is generally a double take. I love Clay like I love chocolate cake and ducklings (and that's a LOT), but at no time do I take on any part of his life as my own personal battle. He's a strong man, and he appears to be telling us that he lets the annoying parts of life just roll off. I cannot agree more with Ansa here: I have seen some people I've been posting with for several years now slowly turn into paranoid, bitter people I don't even recognize. The fandom has apparently ceased to be a source of light hearted fun and celebration for them a long time ago. They've spent so much time dwelling in the muck and mire, keeping up with all the haters and swamp dwellers, that they believe that the entire world is an ugly, hateful place. It's amazing how trivial all the "hater" activity is when you just stop looking for it.
  9. ITA with this. Most of us have to report to someone else, whether a boss, a record label, shareholders, etc. None of us are immune to creative differences with those "in charge". I know some of the fans want to remove every obstacle from Clay's path, and I think that's dear and sweet, but it's not the real world. And sometimes, creative struggles can benefit an artist in the long run. Some fans seem to assume that the CD Clay didn't make this time around was the Holy Grail of all that is music. Perhaps it wasn't. Perhaps Clive was actually right. I guess none of us really know. I would love to hear what Clay would produce free of any kind of restrictions, and perhaps we someday will, but I can't pine away for what I didn't get when I don't KNOW what I didn't get. As far as the blue hair thing, embrace it! The creative rebels I went to high school with were among the most successful in our class years later. I was a "punk" type in high school, and my parents were cool with it as long as my grades were good and I wasn't drinking or on drugs. I just liked to look creative.
  10. I'm curious to know how the music industry is adjusting to the changes in consumer purchasing habits. Someone upthread brought up downloads and YouTube. I think that less people are listening to radio today and more people are file sharing. With Itunes, people can just go download the one song they want, so how is the music industry responding to how people purchase music now? Is that affecting how full CDs are marketed? Also, how does the industry, in general, feel about AI? These are artists chosen by "the people" rather than by the suits in the industry. Do they feel AI contestants are a cash cow, given the instant recognition they have coming off the show, or are they a liability?
  11. So.Much.Word. You know, there are enough ACTUAL disses of Clay one encounters on a regular basis that it seems ridiculous to actually go out hunting for more. I don't know how it benefits anyone to live their fandom life in a perpetual state of righteous indignation. Of course, you do realize that all employees of RCA AND AI wake up each morning with the singular goal of destroying Clay Aiken's career, right? I won't even be pissed if Clay isn't mentioned because I simply will not have enough information to know why. I can ASSUME that he is being dissed, but none of us will really know for sure what is behind any decision to not mention or feature Clay. For all I know, that might have been what Clay wanted. In any case, I am ultra busy this week and am financially tapped out for the month, so I will neither be watching nor donating, but it's not because of any animosity towards AI. As much as folks think Clay has been relentlessly dissed by AI, I think he's had far more attention than the majority of runners-up, and even more attention than at least one winner. (Ruben, and possibly Taylor) If we want to talk about dissing, what about the times Ruben has been featured in the audience without getting to perform? What about Bucky being briefly shown during Country week, when he might have been tapped to perform, and getting Fergie instead? Clay has actually come out better than many alumni. For sure. Poor Sanjaya has endured far more disses in only a few months than Clay has probably had in his entire career, and he's just a 17 year old boy.
  12. Welcome, Karen Eh! Awesome! I hope the clack is available before 10:30, as I have to leave the office for a long meeting today.. About the IGB thing... I am SO glad I have this forum in which to vent. I seriously love you guys... :F_05BL17blowkiss: At my home board, I was just shocked and disgusted at the level of venom displayed at AI and the AI judges. It's fine to roll your eyes at AI's fund raising campaign. It's okay to not contribute. I'm not contributing, myself, as my charity dollars are already earmarked. But the over-the-top suspicion and hatefulness, just because of old grudges about Clay, are so off-putting and transparent. One particular poster states as fact that AI doesn't care about children and that Simon, specifically is uninterested in charity work. Now, I am not an AI or Simon apologist, but how in the heck can state as a FACT that they know what's going on in the minds of those who work for AI? :angry22: We don't really know why we haven't heard Clay's name in conjunction with IGB at this time? How can people make assumptions? A few of these posters are completely predictable- Clay and those who support him are saviors, and anyone who is perceived to have dissed Clay is Satan. I just can't hang with that mentality, and though I am not going to contribute to IGB, I don't see Clay at the center of any of this. Hopefully, many children will be helped by the efforts of both parties.
  13. couch tomato, I bow to you. Are you hiring minions? I've already pledged to KAndre, so I'll have to do double duty, I guess. Wow. I am SO proud of Clay right now. While I didn't service or harass anyone to find out his actual itinerary, I think many of us probably just tended to catch the not-so-subtle clues that were publicly available. I am not exactly sure what having Clay's actual itinerary would do for me, other than making me feel supar speshul, and I am far too lazy to work for supar speshul status. Yup, yup, yup! I just couldn't live in a world where Diss Spotting or pearl clutching were my favorite hobbies. I have seen what I perceived as perfectly innocent mentions of Clay in the media turned into Gigantic Disses. I have seen associates of Clay vilified because when fans snooped on their web pages, they found that said associates weren't making their own web sites All About Clay. I think other Idol contestants and Clay's own associates are under special scrutiny. The problem with making Clay the center of your universe is that eventually, he'll disappoint you and you'll have this maddening love/hate relationship with him. And the problem with unrealistic expectations is that you are doomed to be constantly disappointed. No, Clay is not going to sell 5 million CDs his first week next time around, nor will he recreate the bass clef. If you expect him to do so, then you're going to end up looking for someone to burn at the stake and soon, the wild conspiracy theories begin. The tendency to make the world All About Clay is one of the things that drove me out of my mind on the boards. Express opinions and disappointment, definitely, but PLEASE don't act as if the sky is falling on a daily business. I just expect a level of emotion that seems proportionate to the disappointment. It's such a relief to post here with so many reasonable, smart, sane people. I wish I could quote and word you ALL. :F_05BL17blowkiss: In a way, I am sorry to see such reasonable, SMART folks as clayzorback and YSRN give up on the OFC. I hate that there is no balance there, though we still have others who fight the battle. But it's not worth the headache, is it? There are so many ways to spend one's time. I guess I need to get an avatar, eh?
  14. I think that on most fan boards, the decision to allow negativity about Clay but not other posters might be justified by the fact that Clay was not an active, posting member of that board. However, since Clay IS a member of the OFC, he should have the same right to "non-bashing" that any other member of that board has. Supposedly, members are not to bash other members. Of course, that rule is a joke, as last time I checked over there, people were being absolutely vile to one another. All I can say is that you couldn't PAY me to be an admin over there. ITA, ansa. I think there are some huge battles that are at the center of the fandom right now, and some folks think of the OFC as the place where they can battle for "justice". I also agree that some people go over there to misbehave in ways they cannot get away with at their own "home" boards. WORD, divayenta. I feel like I'm living inside a Jerry Springer episode when I visit the OFC. I tend to believe that board owners have the right to set the tone and rules to their own boards. If someone wants to set up a Clay FAN board that allows any criticism of Clay, no matter how vile, then folks have the choice to not sign up, and they also have the choice to call the board out in disgust. I think over the past year or so, I've finally been able to not let mean-spiritedness in other people ruin my mood. There are some posters who seem as if Clay can do absolutely no right in their minds, and yet they still obsessively attend as many concerts as possible, usually in the FRONT ROW, pay for Stub Hubs and such, and then complain bitterly about everything. So, my revenge is that I no longer become angry with them. I just pity them. It must suck to be someone with an obsession and an addiction that doesn't even please them 99% of the time. I'm just happy I'm me and not them. I will say this. Anyone who complains frequently about Clay's hair might want to make sure they are elegantly coiffed whenever they attend Clay-related events. Though I don't care if people post negative comments about Clay's hair or clothing style, I do tend to assume that when I meet some of the biggest hair and style critics in real life, they'll be elegantly turned out and stylishly coiffed. I know that I have bad hair days and bad clothing days, and therefore, I tend to not be particularly critical of Clay's style or hair. So.much.WORD., Kandre I think some people just can't take a hint. I would only have to be blown off one time by Clay to get the message. Have a great vacation, ldyjocelyn!!!
  15. YSRN, I related so much to what you posted about your fandom. I pretty much have the same attitude you do. I'm trying to get to a "live and let live" place where other peoples' posts lose the power to bother me. I'm about three quarters of the way there, but I still have a strategically placed Maalox bottle lying around. Though the teeth are fine with me. I have to completely agree with you, Ansa. Much as I wish I didn't. Clay still is doing phenomenally well compared to most other artists, and I wasn't one who was wringing my hands when the sales for ATDW came in, but Clay has lost some fans over the past few years, and if he chooses to expand his fanbase, he does need to work on either radio play, more touring, or most likely a combination of both, as folks who haven't heard anything from Clay in the past few years are more likely to attend a concert if they have heard Clay on the radio. I remember the early days of the fandom and how many people have kind of disappeared over the last few years. I think attrition is normal- many people have short attention spans or have life changes that make them abandon certain hobbies. Some people had unrealistic expectations of Clay that were not met, and left in a huff. I have to imagine some of them go through this pattern in life over and over. I know some people have left the internet fandom but still support Clay, but many really have moved on. That all said, Clay can make a great living with the fanbase he has now, and he doesn't NEED to expand it unless he wants to grow his career to the next level. Frankly, though, I'd love to see some new blood in the fandom. I think radio play could help bring in a more casual, less intense (and demanding) kind of fan. I'd love to see the fandom a bit more mellow. Seeing the general freakouts and shaking fists over a single scheduling error is a bit more drama than I would prefer. So many good posts today. I can't even begin to list them all. You guys rock!
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