claytonic

Couchie, I may as well take the opportunity to say this.

I hope you never run the country.

You have the worst communication skills for someone running anything at all. Oh maybe I am just used to higher standards. Half the time you don't even make sense.

deleted

...

say what you want about me but I'm not having this. couchie

http://findingclayaiken.invisionzone.com/i...st&p=106953

My non work day has suddenly gotten busy so I will respond later to your tome or not. But you are not a weakling. You can handle yourself so this talk about bullies throws me every time.

The quote you posted of mine has absolutely nothing to do with you. NOTHING. If you want to take every post and turn inward there is nothing I an do about that. But if you do it to me don't know why I would believe you aren't doing it to everyone. My post was about the author of that article doing unnecessary protection of Clay. And I would say it again a million times.

Later for the rest of it.

If my post had nothing to do with it, why did you ask me to "kindly email the person a private correction and let it be over. But that's just too easy - let's make this tiny thing into something larger than it needs to be." That's following my post telling you about the error at CANN. If you weren't talking to me, what.. you were talking to the journalist ... was the journalist a member of this forum? Gees Couchie, sometimes I really can't make head or tail of what you are saying but this takes the cake.

And please, don't say turn what you need to own as MY problem that I am doing to everyone else. I don't have a problem with the way most people post, they usually quote, which means I know exactly what they are addressing. Read my post, and then read your response directly underneath. That is typical of how you respond to posts.

The tone I am using matches yours. It should NOT be regarded as aggressive.

OK this is not what I wanted to wake up too. You can't be stalked on a message board especially if you are in the thick of every conversation. And if you are you have 100 witness to inform the police. And whoever is feeding your stalking theories needs to woman up RIGHT NOW. I'm like judge Judy. I give no credence to heresay.

I said my POSTS were stalked, that was the observation passed on to me. Stalked/targeted, and jumped on and refuted and where possible, high-fived for good measure. It became a pattern. And no, I won't be giving anyone's name. They can do it themselves if they want to but why would they want to? Most aren't even members, so no point in telling you. They contact me via my email address which they found in the Glossary if they didn't know me beforehand. You'd be amazed at some of the observations. If you think this is all 'heresay', that's okay with me, you can believe what is easier and more comfortable for you to believe, or you can stop and think about it. Your choice.

Sorry, but I am not in the thick of every conversation. There are many posts that don't interest me. For one thing, I am not interested in Clay's love life because I feel it is disrespectful to intrude on his privacy, that is the least I can do even though I think he has resigned himself to the fact he can't do anything about it. I am more interested in his beautiful son, although I feel guilty about THAT intrusion of privacy but I have a soft-spot for babies and Parker won't be a baby for much longer. And I don't involve myself in some non-Clay topics such as movies, television, sport and other posts I don't agree with or I find utterly boring, but I pass them over, just as others who are not interested in some of what I post, pass over my posts. No sweat about that. That is normal behavior.

I've been reading DJS for 6 years. Her post was like Clay's blog in that there was nothing new in it LOL. That's her posting style. Everybody has one. . I was so sensitive to your complaints last time Claytonic that I decided not to respond to your posts, missing out on conversation that I wanted to be a part of it. Until I thought WTF..what the hell am I doing? This is MY board too.

Right, then you know that djs111 has a tendency to throw a tantrum out of the blue if someone says something she doesn't like. Regarding a discussion about Clay, one member made a very valid comment about Clay being stubborn. You should have heard djs go on about it. I went to find the actual text from LTS and posted it, and that caused another flare up. It is totally bizarre. You know, just because we make a comment about Clay that doesn't involved gushing about him, it doesn't mean we are being nasty about him. It is ludicrous that we have to walk on egg-shells over a simple opinion about Clay. Come on, what's the average age of the posters in here? It is ridiculous.

I have a style too and not everyone likes it. DJS111 crossed the line when she took a swipe at my country. That was the straw that broke the camel's back. It's not a put down I will tolerate from anyone. Are you fine with THAT kind of style?

You were sensitive to my complaints? Heck, you never even answered a direct question I was waiting and waiting for you to respond to. I asked you if bullying was condoned in this forum and you never answered. I thought it was an important question. In fact, from my understanding, you weren't interested in answering my question because the board was having a 'smut' session and my question was out of context. I will find the posts if you want, including the one from you to 'read the room', because I was the only one out of step with the smutting. At the time, however, I thought you wouldn't answer because you didn't want to admit me that the bullies in this forum have free reign to do what they like.

Here's an example of how you slammed me when CANN was relatively new to me and I noticed an inaccuracy and pointed it out because I was wondering how reliable that site was going to be in terms of factual information. Since I am less informed about Clay matters than most in the fandom, it always bothers me if I know something an information site (such as CANN) was wrong about. The link below will take you to my post, to which you responded like this:....

Although I was subdued in my response to what you said above, I was startled and somewhat hurt about being slammed over such a small thing., I did not understand what you were going on about. Was it appropriate to slam a member who had no idea about the historical furore. Oh, I am learning about it all now, and it is the only reason I decided against joining the OFC. I've been told too many times on this board how crazy all those fans are over there and how terrible it is. Why would I put myself in a position of being tempted to go there when anything and everything that is important is revealed in due course and I can know about without all the crap. You'd be amazed how many fans have told me they rarely involve themselves actively in Clay forums anymore because it is just not worth the angst when they are being pushed around and told what they are allowed to think and say.

Now that the entire board is involved I'll say to everyone as I did notice the snippityness yesterday. This is a message board and if you don't want responses we have a problem. If you want people not to disagree with you, we have a problem. If you say something provocative expect disagreement. If you say the sun is shining - someone will say it's raining. That's LIFE on a message board.

Good grief, It is not about disagreeing that bothers me. It is about the WAY it is done, the belittling, the humiliation. It's why some members visit and read but NEVER post and/or NEVER join. They still feel a connection with Clay but they prefer to keep connected from a distance. They have too much respect for themselves to subject themselves to Clayboard bootcamp.

I understand what it's like to read some body's name and to start rolling my eyes and getting pissy before I read the first sentence. Unfortunately nothing good will come of it, for anyone, especially those of us who have to deal with the fall out. Kandre is not around but something she said before is rolling around my head - let's all conjur up her voice as we read:

QUOTE

KANDRE'S NOT AN ADMINY POST

I said all of that to say this: We expect you to speak your mind, both about Clay and the board, but would like y'all to post in a way to avoid defensiveness on all parts - yours and anyone else's - it makes real communication difficult. It makes posters wary, and we really would like to avoid the wariness that leads to a lot of bad feelings.

or another beauty

QUOTE

Why even communicate with each other if you don't want some sort of acknowledgment of what you think? If it didn't make a difference to me what another poster felt or thought, I either wouldn't be on the board or I would tell them to shut up. That hasn't happened yet. This board isn't about one-sided sharing either. No one is posting in a vacuum, otherwise you might as well just talk to yourself if you don't want the give and take thing.

For one thing, it is hard not to get defensive when a bunch of people ALL go against you, hi-fiving to add extra weight to throw on you. Any wonder why those who don't agree with them don't want to be involved? Terrible, isn't it, when people are too scared to say what they want to say because the heavies on this board make them feel they have no right to their opinion, which happens to be different.

See my response above - sharing opinions and having discussions is one thing. Belittling someone to boost one's own ego or self-importance and be in good standing with the "popular girls group" is tantamount to bullying. Trust me, that word was also fed to me from someone else. "as the mountain to the climber is clearer from the plain" (Kahlil Gibran)

When someone never ever acknowledges your post or indeed your existence despite over 1000 posts EXCEPT to attack what you have said, I have a problem with that. There is one person, only one person in this forum I have despised for some time. The others, some I give them the benefit of the doubt that they are having a bad day and need an easy target, or it's a quirk, we all have them. I gave you the benefit of the doubt the day you tore into me about my CANN post ... I figured you were perhaps tired, taking care of family needs etc. But you know what I also have RL stuff to deal with, do YOU ever give me that consideration on this board? Like the time you and KAndre flippantly dissed and dismissed everything I said regarding how I felt about Beyonce's behavior over Jennifer Hudson's tragedy....that was very close to the bone for me because I too experienced a situation where someone I thought was my friend (with a long family-type history) kept their distance when I suffered a major tragedy, yet there were others that I expected nothing from who bent over backwards to help and comfort me. I couldn't believe the attitude from you and Kandre. Yes, I felt for Jennifer Hudson, not because she was a celebrity because God knows I don't get star struck (and still at times can't quite get the OTT gushing over Clay), but because she was a human being who was in so much pain, and just at that time, I felt it with her. Are you so insensitive.. even if you didn't agree, who was damn Beyonce to you that you had to defend her cold and uncompassionate behavior? I've never felt quite the same about you and KAndre since that day and I almost left the board that day because I couldn't believe everyone on this board was indifferent to someone else's monumental tragedy, until I realized they possibly didn't feel comfortable contradicting you and Kandre's strong opinion because I refused then to believe that this board is full of cold-hearted, uncompassionate people. Not comfortable to say what they really think, yes. Cold-hearted, maybe some but not all. The considerable respect and high regard I had for both you and KAndre was killed that day. Had all the mods joined in with you and KAndre, I would have left and never returned. I probably would have left the fandom as well. That is how strongly I felt, yet you didn't have the empathy to sense it.

If it gets to the point where you can't stand to see a name then it's your job to put THEM on ignore. You can't force that choice on someone else. If you are being hounded in PMs that's a different story. But Hounded is the key - if you are giving and taking that's why it's there -- to spare the rest of us. Again if you don't trust me to do something about being hounded then talk to Bottlecap, KAndre, JMH or LadyJ.

I first needed to know what the rules were here about bullying before I talk to anyone else on the administrative team. If bullying, belittling, humiliating and pushing around members who aren't "originals" or who don't agree with everything the "in crowd" stipulates, members need to be told IN ADVANCE.

I am tempted to say for anyone who wants to discuss this go to feedback. But we have never done that and I guess I won't start now. It should be plain that I can pretty much take being called everything but a child of god (TM Obama). But this time I will put up more of a hearty defense. Be forewarned But nothing wrong with a good throwdown right? But let's bring it like adults. This personal sniping offends everyone. .

What does "go to feedback" mean?

Yes, personal sniping is very offensive. I have strong opinions because I have a strong interest in a lot of things, but if someone attacks my posts I will be defensive. I don't mind people disagreeing. It's nice to have someone agree with you but I've never learned anything from anyone who always agrees with me. However, give a civilised reason so that it is actually a conversation, an exchange of information. And like everyone else, I will defend my country if anyone takes a swipe at my homeland, even if it was only to hurt me. That falls into the bullying category when you touch on someone's country, particularly when someone from the most powerful country in the world takes a swipe at a much lesser country. In my case, I am very sensitive about it because I have suffered directly as a result of some of the decisions my country took to support the USA in stupid wars. I think it was Oprah who, standing up and facing her audience, asked the question: "WHY does the world hate America". I have no other comment, but don't shoot the messenger... go and ask Oprah what she was talking about, that's if you really don't know what she was talking about.

Actually, 'stalking' was someone else's term for the way you have been compulsively refuting every single post I have made.

I wasn't 'setting traps'. I simply posted what I wanted to say but started to take notice of the way you jump on my posts. You know, there are people who read this board, who are very cluey... they aren't even members.

djs111

BLOCK ME. IGNORE ME.

I am too stupid for you to waste your time on.

NOW QUIT STALKING ME.

Actually,

claytonic

, I think you need to reread my post....because never once did I mention you. Just because my post happened to fall after yours just means I was typing at the same time, in response to someone else.

I wasn't directly responding to your post either, I included it because I was adding my comments (rather than responding to yours) to what you said, especially the part where Clay was 'pissed' about the association. Sorry, I should have highlighted that part ... that whole association thing annoyed me as well, and I don't blame Clay for not being happy about it.

It wouldn't surprise me that another point Clay was trying to make, is the point he brought up in response to a different question for a suggestion on a "gay man's biography". Which was, that just because he is gay does not mean that's all he is about. I saw many, many, many posters who just assumed that because they think Adam is gay (he must have slept with SO many people...because he's never said so!)....that Clay would be a "fan". To be honest, I think that kind of pissed him off also.

Not for one nano second did I ever, EVER associate Clay with Adam. They are chalk and cheese on so many levels. I don't define Clay by his sexuality. I think of Adam as a great singer, not a great 'gay' singer. If any association was to be done on my part, it would have been Clay/Kris because when they were on Idol, they both had a kind of boy-next-door image.

Just can't add much to that - and it was not like Prop 8 passed with 100% voting one way or the other.

GollyGeeWiz I had no idea... I thought voting always represented either 100% one way or the other. D101 D101 D101. Here, let me slap the side of my own head so you don't have to hurt YOUR hand doing it.

AI is just a TV show.

Yes I know, I am so sorry about writing about a TV show and that such drivel could have compelled you to drag yourself away from your ball game in order to enlighten me. I guess my frivolous interest in new artists in the music scene is less important.

Adam is just another singer.

<sigh> You're so right, so, so very right. In fact, absolutely right. Dammit, these singers who go on TV in high-rating, major singing competitions, causing viewers to have opinions about them. Who do they think they are? I feel your pain.

I don't even think the vote was any kind of statement, as Clay says.

Oh wait, did Clay say that? OK, then that must be right. Thanks for informing me, I would hate to ever disagree with what Clay says, unless of course he says he is stubborn, in which case I know I need to understand that when Clay said he was stubborn, he wasn't really saying he was stubborn and only myopic idjits would read the word "stubborn" and ASSume he is speaking English. OMG, what a tantrum you threw when a member of this board had the audacity to say that Clay was stubborn, something Clay stated about himself in LTS. But thank you for reminding me, I really must smack myself in this regard. Wait, let me get the whip, that will leave some long term marks as a tangible reminder and maybe even cause some kind of short term bleeding.

In fact, for every person who theoretically rebelled against the judges' pimpage, there may have been a person who wanted to climb on what was supposed to be the winning train.

Oh, that is really a difficult concept for me to grasp. I may need time to digest it but I don't really know if I am capable. Can you pretty-please retype all that .... but s-l-o-w-e-r and no big words.

Maybe the voting is more meaningful in smaller countries or something?

Um dunno... I personally would not know as I am not as clever as anyone living in the U.S. of A. How dare anyone from some faraway insignificant country with a negligible population have a difference of opinion with an AMERICAN. God Bless America, fearless leader of the world. But waaaaaaiiiiit... weren't you the patriotic American who was upset because you wanted to come and live in MY small, American-butt-kissing country but you didn't meet the selection criteria... let me put it in another way... we.didn't.want.you. It must be awful to miss out on the benefits of living in a country that has a free health scheme, where lottery winnings - woohoo to me - are tax-free, where the life-style is arguably one of the best in the world. But look on the bright side, YOUR BIG COUNTRY gets to determine which country to attack, and all you have to do is tell my country to kiss your ass because we're either with you or against you. Don't you dare make such a snide put-down about my country again.

As an "original online fan", I do tend to be dismissive of anything applied across-the-board to "us" or "we" or whatever. And will continue to be dismissive.

First, show me what across-the-board whatever I applied to "you", plural. Secondly, darnit, I forgot... I am not an original fan, I only discovered Clay a year later than the original fans. I should listen to the original fans, they are always right, they know what to dismiss, what not to dismiss, who is a good singer, who is not, who is a good fan, who is not. Hail the original fans, may you always put new fans in their place ... if they want to be a Clay fan, they must never have an opinion of their own, especially if they are repeating an opinion Clay expressed about himself that you don't agree with. (so... were you calling Clay a liar or just delusional?) So Clay doesn't need new fans, he has the original ones, except, of course, for the original ones who have left because they can't support gay artists. Hm, is it better to be an original fan who left the fandom, or be a non-original who accepts Clay exactly as he is. That's a hard question. Way too hard for a non-original, non-American fan to try and figure out.

And predicting patterns? Bwahahaha! Sometimes I can correctly predict the posters, for and against something. I do resent the implication that if Adam was straight, I would like him and/or vote for him. Nope. Has nothing to do with it. Maybe roll my eyes at the implication would be more accurate.

I am so sorry for causing you to feel negative emotions such as resentment because I posted a what-the-heck prediction. Please try your very-very best to believe me when I say I didn't actually imply any such thing but it is clearly my fault that I nevertheless caused you to ASSume it due to my poor communication skills. Must be because I am lapsing back to the time in my life when I spoke two other languages and not a word of English. Let me think back to yet another smaller, non-American country I was living in back then.

You know, I have an idea, why don't you block me, then you don't have to force yourself to nit-pick and come up with any little thing you can think of in order to DIFFER. You know, there is a way to differ with someone without flippant rudeness. I am not the only one who has been keeping track of the way you have been stalking my posts for no reason other than to deliberately refute every.single.thing I say, even if it means clutching at straws to do it. At first I thought I was imagining it, so I started making some deliberate posts and you took the bait, every time. Heck, I have now come to the conclusion that if I were to mention that my own dog was mostly black, you'd find a way to differ with my definition of what constitutes a black dog that belongs to me. What have I done to you ... what, have a conflict with one of your board-member friends and you are trying to chalk up some feel-good brownie points in your favor? For the most part, I don't hold grudges. I have a disagreement and tomorrow is a new day. Life is too short for grudges. If I 'stab' anyone, I 'stab them in the front' where they can defend themselves. That's the difference. I don't entertain myself by b*tching about people behind their backs and then acting it out on the board. Good grief, I almost offered two members of this board tickets to Vegas to see Clay but in the end, couldn't decide who to ask. And there was only one person on this board I wouldn't have offered it to. That's how much I don't hold grudges.

I would hate for you to read my posts and have feelings of resentment towards some tiresome non-American, non-original Clay fan. That will free up more time for you to watch your ball game in peace, resting-assured that I know nothing about ball games except that there is usually a ball involved. It means I will never post anything about ball games that you have to read and refute. I promise to never learn to understand a ball game because of the danger that I may become a ball-game-fan, but worse, a non-original, non-American ball-game-fan.

So is it a deal? Block me. PLEASE. Ok, I could block you, but I've never had to do it before on any forum.

And mods/admin, before you tell me I should have taken this post to PM, please be told that I did try but djs111 is not accepting PMs. However, a couple or so months ago, I DID succeed in sending a PM and asking pretty much what the ??? If you want to see the post and the response, I will forward it to you.

Yes, there are lots of Christians with open minds and big hearts who are anything but bigots, but the situation that developed regarding Proposition 8 is enough to convince me that there was enough homophobia across the board voting against the idea of a gay American Idol. "We" aren't as tolerant as "we" would like to believe. JMO

I don't know who "we" are, but I just disagree. I don't see the Idol vote as indicative of anything beyond a vote in the 8th season of Idol. I rarely watch the show anymore, although I don't have a problem with it, I just don't have time. And I certainly don't vote, but I wouldn't have voted for Adam under any circumstances, because he disqualified himself with his butchered version of One, which I did see. And even though I left a homophobe husband over Elton John, I can't be counted on to vote for the gay guy. I don't see the Idol vote as a "cause."

Since you are clearly NOT homophobic, I don't understand why you would assume I was talking about how someone like you would vote if you were to vote in AI when there is a gay contestant earmarked for victory.

I was talking about the kind of homophobic person who may possibly not even care about AI, but had heard about an openly gay contestant who was poised to take the title and how the judges had all but crowned him. I heard someone once say "never, never underestimate the level of hatred harbored by homophobic people, they can't stand it that there is already an unacceptable (to them) level of gay acceptance in the entertainment industry." The internet allows them to network amongst themselves, and carry out their agenda.

The net has some very dark 'communities' ... they don't feature in our lives and so the vast majority of us have no idea they exist, or that they exist at the extreme level that they do. I would never have believed it myself except that I am on various email contact lists, some of which I have no idea how I ended up on, and rather than unsubscribing and pretending they don't exist, I decided to periodically read what they have to say, and I tell you, it is chilling what goes on in the minds of some people. Pure hatred against anything that is foreign (in terms of 'unfamiliar') to them. It is fitting that the word 'phobia' is in the word that describes an anti-gay person because the absolute and extreme opposite of love is not hate, but fear.

ETA: I used the term "we" because at the end of the day, each of us, in the corner of our own little world, make up the bigger picture of how social attitudes change. There has been vast changes, VAST, but it isn't as progressive at the level some people like to believe it is.

EATA: Last year, someone who knows nothing about Clay except that he was in AI and that I like him, sent me a YouTube video of one of Clay's less than impressive vocals (I wish I could remember which one it was) and I sent back his AI performances of UM, BOTW, Solitaire and said something along the lines of "don't judge on one performance". Another person sent me that performance of Clay doing a fun send up of Madonna, Justin Timberlake etc, except they didn't send it to me for the same reason a Clay fan might have. With some people, I don't even bother explaining. You see, it cuts both ways. One thing I constantly try to remind myself .. don't jump to conclusions, give people a chance and maybe another chance ... because no one is perfect.

Yes, there are lots of Christians with open minds and big hearts who are anything but bigots, but the situation that developed regarding Proposition 8 is enough to convince me that there was enough homophobia across the board voting against the idea of a gay American Idol. "We" aren't as tolerant as "we" would like to believe. JMO

On a brighter note, even if Adam is not your thing, if you have a good ear for vocal music and accents, give this a chance:

Adam Lambert at age 22

Come to Me, Bend to Me - Brigadoon

Conclusion: Another anomaly?

Nah. Not going to be that big of a deal.

And just maybe, just a possibility, consider that people voted for Kris because they liked Kris' music. It could happen! (tm Judy Tenuta).

It is not like the guys had similar styles and choosing between them was apples and apples.

Anyway, it has been a while since votes for anybody translated into sales - just ask Taylor Hicks.

Also think there are narrow-minded people of all religions, not just Christians.

This is why I kind of hoped Adam would win, less angst. I hate that Kris is going to get Ruben-ized and his win diminished a bit.

Second hope is that there are lots of online boards just for Adam.

Heck, not for one minute am I diminishing Kris' talent. I think he is a superb artist, a very talented musician, but in terms of the outcome, I do believe he won for the wrong reasons, and since (I understand) the voting numbers were close, it means that all those bonus votes he got would have helped him over the finishing line.

Of COURSE there are bigots in every religion, I am not pointing the finger exclusively at Christians but it's arguably more about Christians than any other religion who are casting their objection. If this were Idol in a Muslim country, the narrow-minded Muslims would be the ones who would vote against the Adam-equivalent.

And OF COURSE there would also be Christians who voted for Kris for the right reasons, because they love his music and they feel a spiritual kinship with him

And OF COURSE they are those who voted for Kris because they believed he was the best and they will be buying his CD.

I am sorry, I didn't realize I was being so ambiguous. I thought it was clear enough what i was trying to way without writing a huge post. I guess I need to brush up on my communication skills.

hasn't every runner up ever had an album? Nothing new there.

But but but... Didn't Simon (or someone who was TPTB) say that both Clay and Ruben's CD would be launched at the same time? And that was announced IMMEDIATELY after the results, so that Ruben's album was never slated to go out first. Or am I dreaming that?

And yes, I KNOW every runner up has had an album but did they always release BOTH albums at the same time, or released the winner's first, and the runner-up later? What I am saying is that I believe they will release both Kris' and Adam's CD at the same time, like they did with Clay and Ruben.

Second hope is that there are lots of online boards just for Adam.

There is already one called the Lambrits .... Adam's fans in the UK.

Anyway, it has been a while since votes for anybody translated into sales - just ask Taylor Hicks.

Really?

I thought that in all 7 seasons, all the winners sold more than the runners-up, EXCEPT for Ruben and Taylor.

That means, since Taylor won,

Jordin sold more than Blake in Season 6, and

David C sold more than David A in Season 7.

Is this wrong? I haven't been studying results, I just have this impression from stuff I randomly read.

ETA: I can't believe Clay wasn't even mentioned in this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXSWjpyGmrc

I love it when Clay gets riled up about stuff! You go, dewd!

I was disappointed with the outcome of AI last night for about 5 minutes (

seriously, Adam's recording of "Mad World" is haunting and beautiful and I'll be listening to it for a long time

) but I'm over it and ready to move on to "So You Think You Can Dance" tonight.

His 'Mad World' ... wow I was mesmerized.

I predict:

• CDs for Kris and Adam both launched at the same time.
• The Danny fans who voted against Adam rather than FOR Kris ... unlikely to be buying the winner's album.
• The bigots who voted against Adam rather than FOR Kris ... unlikely to be buying the winner's album
• The narrow-minded Christians who voted against Adam rather than FOR Kris... unlikely to be buying the winner's album
• The ardent Adam fans, upset that their Idol was robbed, will be buying Adam's CD in multiples, to prove a point

Conclusion: Another anomaly?

Well, my little corner of the world has been declared a natural disaster area due to rain & wind leading to flooding and injuries and death from flying debris. Lots of power outages, road closures and all the beaches are closed. Funnily enough our house/street is not too bad. Though I did have a rather thrilling drive home yesterday!!

Claytonic

, are you safe and dry?

I had been wondering if you've been affected because the worst of it is at your location, the news looks awful. It seems to be one thing after another. Agh , one minute it's a drought, next minute we have floods. Why can't there be a balance?

Strong winds and rain have created some havoc for me. I have about ten trees, and one of them is uprooted, fortunately it's not one of my favorites or I'd be very upset. I have a huge gum tree and am constantly worried about it because every time there is a major storm, the TV news will show at least a couple of houses with a gum tree lying across the roof. I've had koalas up this gum so it is very special but it is a constant worry when there is a storm.

Regarding the Clay and Adam comparisons... I can't see the similarities at all because while some MAY have suspected he was gay, for the most part, Clay was regarded as a straight, southern Christian boy who was planning a career as a special ed teacher and was talked into auditioning for AI. His performances were NOT flamboyant, unlike Adam. Adam was also 'loud and proud' about being gay, i.e. he may not have shouted it from the rooftops but he certainly was very open about it. Unlike Clay, he was already a professional artist and AI was to accelerate his career, whereas Clay seemed to have the attitude that he'd go with the flow with AI and when it all ended, he'd return to his 'real' job. Where is the similarity?

ETA: Actually, the only similarity could be that Simon will sign them BOTH up immediately and release their CDs the way they did it for Ruben and Clay. (I have no doubt Adam's contract that been waiting for his signature for quite a while)

This isn't a comment on the AI results, just the guests on tonight's finale:

Too many old guys! Rod Stewart? Queen? Kiss? Lionel Richie? Santana? C'mon - book somebody who's not yet eligible for an AARP card next time!

Well, I can't think of Queen without Freddie Mercury, and he's been dead for a long time now. I have a feeling there's a reason why those geriatrics are in the line up ...

I can't see any reason at all why people need to justify spending money on Clay/charity/male prostitutes or whatever the hell else they want to spend their own money on.

Now--if they were spending MY money, that would be another story.

Couchie, I am SO going to be at the AI concert to see Adam--and I'm right there praying with your mama.

I absolutely agree. IMO, spending money is too often an emotional experience and how someone deals with their emotions in this regard (as long as it hurts no one) is totally their business.

I didn't really watch AI except for the odd video here and there until the finals. Just amazing how chalk and cheese the two finalists are - hm... reminds me of another season. I read somewhere that Kris could well win because Danny's miffed fans will try to stop Adam from winning. Adam will have a brilliant career regardless of the outcome, I can totally understand why the judges have been raving about him, he's a music promoter's dream because an Adam Lambert concert would be nothing less than an extravaganza, and he has the vocal ability to back his performance ability. However, I also think Kris is a phenomenal talent, what an amazing musician in every sense of the word. Good luck to both of them.

I know how many feel about AI now but I can only support a 'facility' that unearths such talent for the entertainment world that we are all a part of.

Do you have a pedometer? They are inexpensive and really do give you an indication of how active you have been for the day. A half hour walk isn't really of much use unless you are making decent strides, so it isn't how long you walk for but HOW you walk, and the pedometer measures that for you.

The reward part is really important.... I spent a fortune rewarding myself when I quit smoking 21 years ago, but I calculated that based on how much I was smoking and the price of cigarettes today, I have saved $80,000 from going up in smoke!

My cholesterol is too high, so I have to reduce saturated fat but I still have it as a treat in a pizza or something with coconut milk. To prevent myself from losing weight, I have been using considerably more olive or peanut oil in my cooking and the bonus is my skin is no longer dry!

You should really consider the alkaline diet Liney has been on, she's lost a ton of weight but it is really a very healthy diet. Also, I've read about people who simply changed nothing in their diet except to remove sugar, and they lost considerable weight.

But here's the best solution:

Mad World:

http://video.yahoo.com/watch/5111501...11501/13554087

A Change Is Gonna Come:

http://video.yahoo.com/watch/5111653/13554459

No Boundaries:

(winner's single)

http://video.yahoo.com/watch/5111762/13554757

I think Adam is an extraordinary singer, I'd like to see him do a duet with Lady Gaga. I didn't like the winner's single, and I have yet to find someone who does.

I am trying to find Kris Allen's performances, I would be just as happy for him to win.

ETA:

This link has all the performances

http://mjsbigblog.com/american-idol-season...mance-video.htm

http://www.sendspace.com/file/nzhsf5

A d/l of last night....but it is real slooow,

Thanks for posting this. I love the way he speaks, he is so comfortable on stage in a non-performance role. Love the way he milks the fact he didn't win and was cut from his HS musical, inspiring for the ones who don't win.

ETA: American Idol 8

http://findingclayaiken.invisionzone.com/i...t=0#entry106697

I know that there are some out there who pretend that it's all about the charity but how many of them would buy a ticket and fly or drive all of that way if Clay wasn't going to be there? I'm not even going to pretend that I would. Also, while I think that the BAF is a great charity, if I was going to just pick a children's charity to support, I'd likely pick on that would benefit kids in Ontario.

I always felt that there was no point to the Royals, and in many ways, I still do feel that way. However, during the years of Princess Diana, I saw what a difference she made to charities, how her appearance would draw crowds to an event, how at a special dinner costing $1000 a person, people would turn up just to be seen and be able to say they attended a dinner where the Princess of Wales was the guest of honor. So I changed my mind and felt that if that is what it took to get people with lots of money to spend some of it for an important cause, then that was okay with me, it's a means to an end. Like you, I prefer to financially support needy causes closer to home... however, I never let an opportunity go by to plug TBAF because it is a serious and important cause and it is also one of the reasons I have such a high regard for Clay Aiken.

CRITICAL TRIVIA: Red Hair Alert!!

A health/lifestyle show I was watching revealed that only 2% of the world's population are natural redheads! They also said that redheads have better love-lives . However, they added that due to the 'melting pot', redheads are on the way out, i.e. set to become extinct!!!

Kelly? Her tirade towards Clay was so unexpected. That's one case where my opinion of somebody really changed overnight. I thought that she was a bit self-centered before and I'd gotten tired of listening to her but it was like that tirade was her showing her real colours and it was not pretty. My opinion of her has nothing to do with what anybody else thinks about her. I just lost all respect for her. Done.

Huh?? When did Kelly ever go on a tirade against Clay?? Something else I've missed, obviously! Anyone??

You're thinking Kelly Clarkson, right? I'm laughing because I had the same reaction and started typing along the lines of "whatchatalkin'bout" until I realized it can only be that Ripa idjit. (TM Liney Canfly...)

Pretty much everything on television is manipulated and phony, or... in others words, pure illusion. I don't have a problem with it because I don't look to entertainment programs for honesty and integrity, they are meant to be fun, an escapism (that can be switched off and on at will) from the harsh realities of life. Sometimes they can even be useful in helping us realise that you can't always believe what you see, not even in the news programs, and that's even worse because people would tend to expect that a 'serious' news program has integrity. It doesn't, not if it means losing viewers ...because sensationalism sells.

Actually, I subscribe to the theory that people see what they believe, rather than the other way around but that's a whole other topic....

Claytonic

he definitely was talking about Carrie because he said to Kellie "I like you better than last years winner"

I like Kellie better than Carrie as well

so in that I agree with Simon:Iluvclaysbutt:

Thanks for the clarification, and yes Kellie Pickler is also my favorite blonde from Series #5, and I liked her even better after she thought Europe was a country on AYSTAFG. No kidding, there is something so real about that girl and I love people who make me laugh by just being themselves. Remember her first encounter with calamari? She's a hoot, no wonder Simon just loved her.

I can never forget how he predicted that not only would Carrie Underwood win season #4 but that she would outsell everyone else. I didn't think Carrie could beat Bo Bice, so I was amazed when she won, and now it seems she could pass Kelly Clarkson. I don't think Simon particularly liked country either, but that didn't get in the way of his vision for commercial success. That is all I am saying.

Yet, I also remember him saying re: Kellie Pickler that he liked her better than "the other one from last year"...meaning Carrie.

That was before her career took off....and there is Jennifer Hudson...he never saw THAT coming either. Sometimes he's right. Sometimes he's not. Sometimes I agree with him. Sometimes I don't. Overall, I've agreed with him a heck of a lot more than the others this season

Are you sure he meant Carrie? I thought he was referring to Jessica Sierra. He told Jessica she lacked the "likability factor"... I thought it was the most cruel comment, I never saw anything about Jessica that made her unlikable, just that perhaps the others appealed more to the viewers. Perhaps it's saying the same thing but to say something so hurtful a young girl in front of a huge audience, I thought it was way below-the-belt.

I know AI and all the other reality shows are about manipulation and are scripted, etc....but it has always bugged me that the judges were allowed at rehearsals; just seems if they wanted to present an objective opinion, than they wouldn't see the contestants until the actual performance and we would get an unscripted opinion of the performance. I know not going to happen and that 's not the way the show is set up...but I think it would be a much better show...

this is why I don't like these kinds of shows...too much manipulation and phoniness.

Everything and every person has its good and bad points since nothing is ever simply either black OR white.. So to not watch Idol just because we discover that it isn't entirely what it appears to be, that would be like 'throwing out the baby with the bath water'. That is why I think that those who don't watch it, don't watch for other reasons.... such as perhaps feeling that their precious leisure time can be allocated to something they enjoy more. Idol and its sister-franchises have done more good than bad for undiscovered talent, and while I don't exactly rave about the show, I can't condemn it and I will watch it IF I decide that it is worth my time and interest. I don't watch TV (except for very few shows) and I no longer watch over 90% of the movies most people have seen, so my entertainment hours are allocated differently.

Whilst the ? Got Talent show is not regarded as 'prestigious' as Idol, I prefer to watch it because there is no age limit and restriction about what the talent is....and is very entertaining.

For example...

Ironically, I don't think it would have been a 'tragedy' for Clay if Idol had never existed because he already had another career path mapped out. But it would have been a 'tragedy' for the rest of us.

p.s. Kelly Clarkson's 'breathiness' doesn't bother me because her powerful voice and delivery of it transcends any little quirk that actually makes her unique. I've heard others point out Clay's singing quirks but I like them, it makes him special.

ETA:

I just heard they are making a movie of Frank Sinatra's life, and the actor shortlisted or actually ear-marked to play him is ... (go on guess...)

Jamie Foxx

. Can this be the O-Factor?

Love the trains around the world...even liked rickshaw dude.

WOW hard to believe rickshaws still exist. I thought they would be obsolete by now, and replaced by trishaws.

I have a picture from last summer! KAndre and I were probably his favorite passengers. Just need to find the right external drive...

Oh I have no doubt about being his favorites... if he got an American-sized tip!!!

My burning question is.... did you see him use a cell phone? That's one of the most bizarre things about the preservation of 'primitive' traditions whilst embracing modern, 'indispensable' technology.

ETA:

I have never gotten the "you must only like Clay if you are a fan" mentality. Having said that, I do like some of Groban's stuff, and almost always feel like people are looking at me like I've got two heads when I admit to it. The same with Buble (whom I actually like even more, but then I've always loved "Rat Pack" type of music). I think the key is to not take it all so personally. Like who you like, don't like who you don't like, but give everyone else the freedom to choose those same things. Even if they don't like Clay.

I prefer Michael Buble to Cranky Franky (as he was called here in Oz when he referred to our local journos 'hookers'.... not that they didn't deserve it for relentlessly hounding him).

and... at the risk of sounding utterly sacrilegious to those who worship at the alter of Queen Aretha ... I prefer Kelly Clarkson's version of R.E.S.P.E.C.T. There, I said it! (I also prefer the Aiken version of BOTW ... although I will forever be a fan of Garfunkle)