#31: The Very Handsome Sir Clay of Aiken

[Couch Tomato]

Play, is this your sore topic? Living in California I've come to expect I'd have to travel a lot to see Clay but it does really hurt sometimes. Hurt in the pocket book. I don't have the will power to resist it. I did once and regretted it. Clay came to oakland for the JBT and perhaps we are now counted as a town that won't support him but I think it was a little ambitious to go from pulling down the halloween decorations to Xmas. That was an error that they have not repeated.

yes Cha Cha.. heee but I need both of them..is that possible?

I knew the stage lights were throwing off the color of that suit..that's why I would only commit to DARK heee.

[cha cha trusty]

here's an avie of that for couchie!!

[Iseeme]

Well, not only do I feel bad because I CAN'T see him when he tours but now I'm being made to feel bad because I feel bad about it. Something inherently wrong with that thought process, don't you think? I guess no one needs to tour in the West anymore because there just aren't enough people. That will be a huge disappointment to the venues in San Francisco, Los Angeles, Sacramento, San Jose, San Diego (and that's just the large venues) as well as the indoor and outdoor venues that hold 3,000+ people that are all over the state. OH, and then there's Portland, Seattle, Vancouver, Las Vegas, etc. etc. Not to mention quite a few very large universities and colleges that have venues that are large and host concerts all the time.

I'm doomed to a life of vicarious pleasure!

So - on to the next subject.....

[Couch Tomato]

Hey I feel ya Iseeme. It's easier to be logical when you have 10 shows in driving distance every single time. But this fandom is one of the heart, and always will be.

Heading out!!

[Claygasm]

Hey Play, can you put the pub info in the closing night thread please?

KAndre...you crack me up!!

You mean its not being circulated through super seekrit back channels so as to make sure not to let me know???

Not that I'm paranoid or anything......

Woo hoo annabear! I look forward to meeting you!

I want to see the Tyra clip!!!!

[cha cha trusty]

OK couchie - I tried to move them closer together - will this work???

oops - forgot to make it smaller!!

[KAndre]

looks at her location in Houston where even through we are the 4th largest city in the country, lots of tours simply pass us up...

Not necessarily easier to be logical...I've accepted the fact that despite the hard core fans in Houston (and I will put up our crazy against anybody's), the casual fans simply didn't come to the concert here. They do/did show up in Dallas so for us hard core Houston fans, that 250 mi was just a hop, skip and a jump away. Hell, we though the Tulsa concert was a hop, skip and a jump away. But lord knows I couldn't deal with driving, even in the most comfortable bus in the world, a couple of thousand miles in a week without a serious guarantee of a return. And apparently - it's not there. I understand it's an emotional issue - and that it feels unfair to many - but honestly, it doesn't to many as well.

[Iseeme]

Welllllllllllllllllllll - there is a report that Clay and Hannah were holding hands before the papparazzi showed up yesterday! I thought posting a little gossip might change the subject nicely!!!!

And what, might I ask, were they doing in a grocery store at 10:00a.m.??? Buying apple juice no doubt! Awwwwww..........

[playbiller]

I appreciate that it is difficult to see Clay, but if you are in California, you can get tickets to shows. I never could try when Clay did all those TV shows in LA, but I never ever canget tickets to see TV shows in NYC (except GMA in the park). I don't know how people do it, so I had to wait for a tour. No biggie. There are good and bad things to living everywhere.

I don't mean to insult people, but I have a friend from a small board elsewhere, that decided to skip the JBT in Toronto becauseshe was going on vacation the next week and would be busy packing and stuff, she said she would see him next time. I told her there might not be a next time, and there wasn't. Obviously, she can't be too upset if an inconvenience kept her from one show. but that is her. Everyone is different. Everyone has different levels of missing stuff. There is plenty to miss everywhere. I don't think that fans who live where Clay does tour should be generally classified as insensitive and rude. I am really tired of that. I understand sad feelings, even if I don't share them. I understand money problems, I understand disappointment. I understand priorities. Family before Clay, always.

Now I want to think happy and party and I will go and post the information. And then off to the post office once again.

[Claygasm]

OK couchie - I tried to move them closer together - will this work???

oops - forgot to make it smaller!!

The matching eyeliner is very, very disturbing to me. Not exactly a manly look.

Why the hell was he wearing eyeliner???????

I swear seeing how he looked very close up in the afternoon with that eyeliner colored my whole QVC experience.

[JennaZ]

So many wise words, Ansa! But I start with this:

What I agree with Muski about...is that there is a very strong perception out there that Clay Aiken basically appeals to a certain demographic and a lot of the shots of the audience and the first front row of the concerts do reinforce that picture. But at this point I say...it is what it is and I do believe that this developed because of two things...the type of music Clay gravitates to and the fact that in the past 5 years TC did court this more mature audience first with the release of Solitaire as a single...with the classic style of MCWL then finally with ATDW. I do think Clay went this route because he figures this is the path of least resistance since he is not willing to play the celebrity fame game of partying, wearing the cool clothes, going out with the cool people or going for a a sexier and more current sound that would be more radio friendly.

As someone who is under 40, I have to say that whenever I go to a Clay event (party, concert, signing, etc.), I do feel in the minority. I really do believe that Clay appeals largely (but not exclusively) to 35+ female crowd, and as you said, that's due in large part to the type of music he has sung in recent years. His choices, both in on albums and in concerts, do tend to be more VH1 than MTV. Clay's most modern cover was of "Sexy Back," and that was in a mocking, "look-how-ridiculous-this-is" manner.

It is a double edged sword. On one had, that demographic has the money and means to pay for concert tickets, CD's and merchandise. On the other hand, quite frankly, it is not perceived as the most hip or cutting-edge group. And I suspect there are many in the music industry who would rather go for what's hip and youthful (which may be one reason why they're in so much trouble).

And which may also explain why West Coast promoters may be less willing to book Clay Aiken concerts. I don't think it's simply a matter of population density. I suspect that he's just not at the top of their "hip" list, and with so many other acts in the region, he's just not their first choice. True, there are your Barry Manilow's, your Neil Diamond's, your Josh Groban's who have a similar demographic, but let's face it, their career success at this point is far beyond Clay's.

Clay is not cool. I think he accepts that. In fact, he jokes about it in concerts. However, I'd bet that he also believes there's nothing more uncool than trying very obviously to be cool. He'd rather be himself, and if the coolness comes, so be it.

And who knows? It may still come, but not through deliberate efforts to craft songs specifically for Top 40 radio, or by ingratiating himself to the MTV crowd with an expensive, edgy video, or by rejecting the older fans who supported him throughout his career. If it comes, it will be with music he loves to sing.

And if that success comes, he can tour anywhere and everywhere.

I know it can be frustrating living in a region that doesn't get a lot of tours. As a West Coaster myself, I've missed several tours, as well as Spamalot. However, personally, I just can't hold it against Clay or his management team. Clay is not in a position to tour wherever he wants. As much as I'd love to believe otherwise, he is not the hottest ticket in entertainment. As it is, he and we are extremely fortunate to have the tours we have had, because there are many, many others (including all but a handful of idols) who haven't had nearly the same success.

[muskifest]

And that behavior on some boards would be making me roll my eyes as well. I felt the same last year during the Christmas tour when almost always the first question asked to the cellcerter was "how many men there?"

But ldyjocelyn, how many times does Clay himself make this a point of his banter? Obviously, he sees what he sees when he looks out into audiences. And in many ways, what he sees is is the part of Clay's 'fame' that the people who love to hate can point to and say, "See what I'm talking about?".

Whatthefuckever. I know that KAndre and Scarlett and other people I love and love to have fun with are often in the first rows and I know how they get those seats. I'm in AWE of how they get those seats! I realize, too, that after my most recent posts, any chance I might have ever had of being a lucky beneficiary of one of those extra seats went the way of my 34-A bras, never to be experienced again. But I wasn't referring to KAndre or Scarlett or ...

Look. As I said, everyone has to follow his/her own heart. I will. God knows KAndre will! , and I'm sure nothing I write is going to change anybody else's behavior. It wasn't meant to. I'm not that deluded in my estimation of any literary prowess on my part. What I also believe, though, is that repeated camera pans of the same profile of fan in the audiences of Clay Aiken events that could serve as "proof" of the oft-highlighted and stereotyped perception of his fans does nothing to help entice a broadening of that fan base. In fact, I daresay that seeing such a trademark profile over and over might even discourage some 'outliers' (outlyers?) of that 'demographic' to become part of the fan base.

I can tell you right now how my teenager and my 12 year old feel about me and my 'hobby'. Wait, I don't have to, do I? And as someone said earlier, if Clay were to come out with a radio hit? Hell, they'd do all they could not to show any kind of acceptance or approval of him or the song because then they'd be fans of somebody the 'old, housewife-y, blah-blah' women are.

Wrong, superficial, judgmental? Yep. True? Yep. So it's kinda a 'horse and cart' thing. Which comes first? The music that grabs a wider demographic of listeners and fans, or the fans and their influence that is either positive enough to make the music popular to a wider audience, or negative enough to dissuade new joiners to the club? Does a concert in the desert make more people who live there want another concert in the desert? Or do the people in the desert who want the concert go elsewhere because that's where the music they like is?

I live in the SF Bay Area and have never seriously bought into the 'poor me' anthem, even though Clay has only come to this very large metropolitan area 3 times that I can think of (AI tour, IT tour and a JNT concert, right Couchie? Was he here for the NAT?). Now if I were a fan in Billings, Montana, I'd most likely have done some serious sobbing by now. I don't know all the reasons (other than the obvious ones of time, money and getting the biggest bang for the tour buck) that go into where Clay does his concerts. I go to the ones I can (and some that, when it comes right down to it, CAN'T! heh). Not going to spend energy on that particular issue.

But this is one middle-aged, overweight and sometimes not-so-photogenic mother and wife who is no longer so eager to arrive early and stand in another line outside a tv show, waiting to get in only to be seated in the back anyway because the show would rather not have me in that camera pan. Or maybe worse yet, I don't want to be IN the camera shot if it shows the same profile every time, anyway. I really don't want to be surrounded by large, loud groups of people whose behavior makes the show staff and passersby smirk and talk about "Must be a Clay Aiken crowd" because, well...it is. (And I've seen the smirks and heard the whispers and derisive comments, so they exist. Yeah, if I were a better, more self-arrived person, I'd just ignore them) And I'll be damned if I'm going to spend hours politely standing in said line only to be pushed around by recognizable, omnipresent 'fans' and their very loud, very in-your-face sense of entitlement to be first or second or more important. And although the young "McVargas" type people are annoying and embarrassing to me, maybe they don't bother me so much because I have nothing in common with them. Maybe I'm especially bothered by the more maligned demographic because strictly speaking, I AM one of them.

Yeah, I got my issues around this. And they're mine and I know that the only person I have the right to try to change regarding these 'issues' is myself. So maybe if I ever become a middle aged woman who doesn't LOOK like this demographic; maybe if I ever start wearing a single-digit sized dress and can go braless in a halter top without tripping over my nipples; maybe if the gray hair that is dotted here and there becomes more camera-worthy 'highlights'; maybe if I feel better about myself and how I 'look and seem' to other people I don't know, I'll have grown up and matured emotionally and won't even give it another passing thought. And then I'll be able to really think, "Fuck you" the next time somebody rolls their eyes or tries to hide their amusement at THIS middle aged wife, mother and working woman as she waits in line outside on the sidewalk. Because then...maybe I won't assume they're really making fun of ME.

And now...Dr. Freud tells me that my time is up and his next patient is waiting , so....

Ta-Tah! :F_05BL17blowkiss: I'm off to check out the Tyra download....

[Claygasm]

From PageSix Celebrity Sightings

Clay Aiken

houston and bowery

Wednesday, April 23, 2008 @ 10 AM

I saw Clay Aiken at whole foods! I had to take a second look because he looks different then on AI. He is blond now! He was very friendly and was signing a few autographs. He was with some chic with an accent, who kinda stood to the side waiting for him.

Why do so many think the "chic with an accent" is Hannah? There is no description of said "chic". It doesn't say the "chic" had a British accent. Hell, the "chic" could have had a southern accent! She could have had a Canadian accent! It could be any accent and any "chic" yet everyone assumes it was his eyeliner partner Hannah?

Seems like a pretty big jump to me.

ETA:

JennaZ you are wise beyond your years.

You know, the age thing is only part of it. For me, its more behavior. Some of the most entitled, obnoxious, pushy fans I have seen have been relatively attractive younger middle age - you know maybe early 40's (or maybe they just look that age). They aren't all fat and grandmothers (though some are). Its not always being in the front rows either. Its how some of them get there and how they act when they are there. Its hard to explain, but that's what embarrasses me most. That's what make it so I don't want to admit I am a Clay fan to others. I don't want others to think I am "one of them"!

The age thing bothers me too, but I am one of them in that case, so there is no escaping that one!

Damn it.

[Iseeme]

A pretty big jump? I don't think so. He spends an inordinate amount of work time with a chic with an accent. Certainly makes sense that he's become friends with said chic with an accent. And we certainly haven't seen him with any other chic with an accent lately! Besides, it's all in fun. I doubt they've ordered wedding invitations yet.... It's no big deal. Was just trying to get out of my "poor me I live in beautiful California funk!"

[Claygasm]

Well, I think its a leap because we don't know who he is hanging out with! It could be a friend from home with a southern accent or who knows who. Hannah isn't the only "chic" with an accent he knows!

And if they weren't buying eyeliner together, then it probably wasn't Hannah!

I forgot. I saw this at the CH. Haven't watched it because I am at work, but....

Clay just posted a CD teaser on his youtube here:

Clay Aiken - On My Way Here Album Teaser

[KAndre]

muski, I ain't mad at cha...I guess I'm just...frustrated. If I let people who actually roll their eyes at me (especially 12 year olds), I would be sitting in a cave somewhere, hidden from the world. Nothing self-arrived about it for me, because lord knows I've rolled my eyes at too many wannabe losers walking past me in a variety of lines (dude, I'm sorry, that "soul patch" does not hide the weak chin and spending 750 bucks on a pair of raggedly-ass D&G jeans that will be out of fashion next year is beyond stupid in my book). Even better than saying "fuck you" is pretending that you know them ("Baby! You have GOT to stop stalking me! I threw you a pity fuck once - not happening again. Capisce?" Then laugh at them with your friends. But then again, I never claimed to be nice.)

I simply cannot be embarrassed by some one over whom I have no control. My child acting an idiot in public? I can take care of that. Me acting an idiot in public? I deserve any embarrassment I get. Some random old chunky Claymate? I neither fed nor gave birth to her. Or the rude ass bastard rolling his eyes at her. I don't expect any 12 year old in the world to like what I like because lord knows if Hannah Montana or the Olsen twins or Veggietales or 98% of the Disney channel or bubble gum flavored lip gloss disappeared off the face of the earth, I would do a small war dance of triumph in my living room and never think about it again. Hell, when my sister was 12, she used to drench herself in that odor from hell, Love's Baby Soft. I remember the look on my mother's face when Troy gave her the giant gift box of the stuff. I'm POSITIVE she like the Emeraude I gave her much, MUCH better since it was that nice deep neon green.

eyes JennaZ...

I think you speak the truth.

[Desertrose]

Ok Muski, I have never gotten a seat in the front row no matter what. Are you saying I need to get implants?

[keepingfaith]

If Clay's fan base happens to be saturated with middle-aged women, it goes to prove one thing and one thing only ... that middle-aged women of the third millennium have impeccable taste! (After all, they were around to experience the best of the best musical legends of the 20th century and are now qualified to recognize class and pure talent when they come across it!)

Amen, sister! It was the boomers who made superstars out of the living legends of the past 40 years. We know what's up! The cognigenti condemned the Beatles as ultimately irrelevant (har, har), the Stones as a bunch of no-talent uglies, James Brown as a "race" entertainer with no chance of widespread appeal, and Barbra would never make it without a nose job -- I could go on -- but, we thought otherwise. I won't even go into the early critics of Dylan, but every now and then I watch Don't Look Back just for the lesson!

The greatest stars had the fiercest critics. I remember it well. That's why, to some extent, the controversies and haughty condescensions feed my happy place, because I remember why that stuff happens. Heck, Rolling Stone Magazine simply HATED Led Zeppelin. Pink Floyd was just noise. Oh how they were derided by the "serious" critics in 1969! The critics LOVED and 5-starred so many singers and bands that never did squat.

CG, regarding your aversion to the eyeliner -- he was performing at the theatre which is why he had on eyeliner yesterday, and he was performing on TV which is why he had on eyeliner at QVC. He was wearing eye makeup when I fell for him on AI5 -- so I guess I must have loved it. Fact is, I noted immediately with the Jenna Bush/UNICEF pictures (that everyone seems to think are totally cringe-worthy), he wore no eye makeup at all and was colorless. That, and the extra lbs., are the main problems with those pictures. Clay's eyelashes and brows are so light as to be translucent without eyeliner and mascara. With it on, I think he's just plain Hot, Hot, Hot! It's probably men who would be the first to condemn the make-up, and I don't let macho types define what's manly and sexy in MY brain, because the Tony Testosteroni types never turned me on.

I thought one of the hottest scenes I've ever seen in the movies was in Bandits when Cate Blanchett was polishing Billy Bob Thornton's toenails. I guess I love broken barriers and crumbling stereotypes and people being who they are, and fuck it all.

I did notice the "sighting" at 10 a.m. at Whole Foods with Hannah -- I didn't know Clay got out of bed that early!!!!

I just realized that the CD Release Parties will be on Cinco de Mayo. Parte Ole!

[bottlecap]

From stripedshirts at CV:

Virgin Times Square, NYC will be doing a Cd Signing Event with Clay on May 6th, Tuesday.

The signing will take place at 2pm. Virgin will post this announcement on their site later on today.

1 wristband will be given per cd(s) purchase. These will given at midnight of the 5th/early 6th when cash registers open at Virgin.

Representative(s) from Virgin will be making an appearance at the CD Release Party. They are working on giving some nice promotional items to us.

[Iseeme]

And if they weren't buying eyeliner together, then it probably wasn't Hannah

Boy - ain't that the truth! I sure hope that isn't that permanent eyeliner. Eek!!!!!

Loved the uTube. I wonder where they'll be airing that.....would be nice if it was on TV.

Kandre - I love reading your posts. You have such an incredible way with words! Love's BabySoft. That was the equivalent of men's Aqua Fresh, wasn't it?

Well the good news is this board has great discussions without the extreme animosity and nastiness found on other boards. I don't expect everyone or even anyone to agree with me all the time and you do learn stuff from looking at other people's perspective. I think what embarasses us is a result of our other experiences (whooo waxing philosophical whilst doing laundry and dying my hair!) and what we've either learned to endure or learned to ignore. I think I'm probably hypersensitive where Clay is concerned because my family has laughed at me for 5 years. So when I see what I call OTT behavior it just reinforces the jist of the teasing I've taken. I have NEVER been fangirly over anybody - NEVER. And when hard-pressed, I honestly can't give a good answer to why I am now. I just am! I still don't know what actually caught my interest in that Atlanta audition other than the voice. The voice was always first....the rest has just evolved!!!!

And I don't really care who the chic (chick?) with the accent was. I just hope Clay is having fun and enjoying his life and I'm glad that he isn't just sitting in his loft or whatever watching television!!! I want him to be happppeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee...............

[jmh123]

KAndre, you've said some really brilliant things, and are inspirational to boot. I don't think I've ever seen you write so eloquently about a serious subject. You rock!! I always worry way too much about what people think, and it just makes me shrink up and be boring. Great insights about the fanbase and about the value of an intense fanbase no matter what they look like. Intense fans are by nature...intense. I think we all realize on some level the irony of middle aged fans cringing at all the middle aged fans, but some of us cringe anyway. So I love your attitude!!

On the other topic du jour: sings "I've looked at life from both sides now." Not really, because NC is still on the east coast and usually gets a concert per tour (although none for CITH), maybe two, but it sure is different from when I lived in the NE. I've travelled much more often, and much farther than before I moved. And you know what, the trips have been really fun, on so many levels. So I love travelling to see Clay!! I know for some people travel is impossible, and I haven't had to go cross country, or across the world (claytonic and ausdon and our other faraway members are the ones who are really deprived), so I have lots of sympathy for those who aren't as lucky as I. All in all, living in ClayLand was the bomb y'all.

[muskifest]

eyeliner. Well...yeah, he's made up for the stage/tv/whatever...I'm all for the eyelash darkening. Man has such gorgeous long lashes that are invisible without having some color applied. And I know that he's had eyeliner on the top lid ever since the beginning (although it didn't used to be so heavy)...I'm not a fan of this newer heavily applied, dark and on both lids technique, however. He doesn't need THAT, IMO, and his facial features are so pretty anyway, I don't think the added dramatic effect of the uber-liner does him any favors.

But the main thing about those Clay/Hannah pictures? They could be twins! I swear, look at their individual facial features/structure. They look like siblings..height, coloring, eyes, nose shape, even face shape..amazing. What a striking couple! I think it's cool how Clay's new female friends are so tall and gorgeous (Tyra, Hannah), whatever the relationships are. He's so CUTE!

Will you guys PULEAZE leave me alone so that I can get back to work!?

[playbiller]

HA HA HA HA my sister now has to talk her husband into staying another day and he is not to fond of being away from home as it is. Got to go to the Virgin signing. SO this will be beyind our normal 6 day limit of tolerating each other. We have a rule and stick with it.

[luckiest1]

Wheeeeeeee for the Virgin signing! Too bad I can't stay for it.

As to the other topics du jour......most of them I just can't be bothered to argue about. Yeah, I wish Clay came to Canada. I feel bad for people on the west coast, but I also feel jellus when Clay does TV shows there. I've never been to a tv taping, probably will never get that opportunity. I've never been to a concert I didn't have to bust my ass to get to (other than Toronto which is still 2 hours away). I mean, we are talking passports, change of currency, gas prices up the wazoo, or worse, air fare....but I still feel lucky that I am within driving distance of usually at least a show or two per tour. Of course, driving distance is subjective, mine is within an 8 hour radius, any direction. Heh.

Yeah I'm middle aged. Proud of it. Can be what some might consider OTT at times (again, it's subjective). I wear Clay shirts and sometimes pins, I clap and cheer at opportune times, I will attempt to Clayvert people once in a while, so what? Don't care about demographics. Am jellus of those who have the means to sit in the front row lots of times. Would do it if I could, too. In fact, would attach myself to Clay's bus if I could. Everyone has a different situation....money, spouse, kids, responsibilites, etc. Mine is better than some, I am able to make my own decisions wtihout having to consult a spouse, but I also have to make arrangements for my son. Clay has put me happily in debt. It's my choice, I have decided to enjoy my life the way I want to enjoy it. So shoot me if that makes me OTT.

Eyeliner? How many of "us" would go up on stage as a performer without makeup? Those lights are BRIGHT. His eyes are so beautiful, I love that they are accentuated. I love how Clay looked in the QVC appearance. I think he's looked HAWT at the stage door the 2 times I've been there. I think he'll look HAWT this weekend when I see him live and in person, even if it's only in his Spamalot wig.

I can't wait for Saturday!

[Iseeme]

Playbiller - I read where they're only giving out 175 wristbands at midnight for the 2:00 signing - and he can only stay for 1 1/2 hours. Yikes - you may be standing out in line for awhile!!!!

By the way - when do the predictions come out about how many CDs they think Clay will sell the first week! Is that after the release date? I can't remember.