#38: The man just oooooooooozes awwwwwness

[wandacleo]

Just to clarify. I don't think anyone has the right to be "disappointed" in what two decent legally adult human beings decide to do with sperm or procreation. It's nobody's damn business but those involved. Jesus Christ. Clay owes us NOTHING related to his private life. He's a person in his own right, not a piece of public property.

[playbiller]

-So, will no one help me capture Clay saying he is going to sing the extended version of "yes, you are my baby" later? I just need to get the beginning ofthat Clip.

[cha cha trusty]

Just want to add my 2¢ here.......

It sounds to me like his own mother is thrilled to be a grandmother. (I know I would be!)

And this is the woman who taught him the "fear of God" and to "trust in Jesus."

And if she is not disappointed, then that's good enough for me.

And just to mention, that "B" word never even entered my mind until I read a post here a few minutes ago.

There are plenty of ways to have a family, and I am happy that Clay found a way.

I hope we hear more details sometime, but like I was telling someone last week,

probably by the time he gets around to writing another book of memoirs, the likes of us will be long gone!!

I still feel he has not been idle, career-wise, in these past couple of months.

I choose to think that his little-pea-pickin' brain (that is a joke!!) never stops working.

:F_05BL17blowkiss:

[jmh123]

-So, will no one help me capture Clay saying he is going to sing the extended version of "yes, you are my baby" later? I just need to get the beginning ofthat Clip.

Sorry, I don't know how. Maybe someone else knows. I don't think anyone currently posting does though.

ETA: Ah, cha cha does. Of course!

[cha cha trusty]

play - I can help you capture that! (but I have to go to bed soon!)

if you want to IM me, please do! (or PM me... if you don't have AIM)

[Claygasm]

So wandacleo, my interpretation of who you were calling bitches and saying good riddance to was correct? You were referring to anyone who is disappointed in this situation for any reason? IMO there is a clear difference between someone being disappointed in something he does and expecting him to conform to how they think. I am disappointed for my own reasons. At no time did I ever think that meant Clay should live his life according to what I want for him. Is someone like me a bitch?

Have you never been disappointed in the choices someone in your real life made? Do you tell them good riddance too?

Sorry but I find that judgement of others to be as bad as those crazy zealots who are passing moral judgements on Clay and Jaymes.

Disagreeing with someone, being disappointed in someone, being angry at someone is not the same as telling someone how to live their life.

[cha cha trusty]

play - you can find two versions of the vid HERE.

I wasn't sure how long you wanted it or where you wanted it cut off!

Let me know if this is OK.

night now!

[Couch Tomato]

I have to say I haven't read much elsewehere but seeing that judgemental person quoted in the News and Observer pissed me off. I'm not so blunt as Wandacleo but I have to wonder if someone is SO disappointed what is she going to do about the fact that Clay's family unit is something she finds intolerable and how will it manifest itself on whatever board she is on. I don't understand how someone can acknowledge the child will be loved and cared for yet still find that unacceptable. I had a traditional family unit I was an adult-- I would have preferred my mom leave that family unit and take us with her.

[playbiller]

I heard that at one board someone was so disappointed in Clay, she decided to follow that moral bastion, Justin Timberlake. BWAH.

Thank you Cha Cha, Sorry, I went off to do some work and am now off to bed.

And here the video Clip where Clay comes out after Jack Black sang yes, that is my baby.

See, he did tellus before TMZ

[luckiest1]

Luckiest, kind of glad you decided to give it up, although I'm glad the time you had was good. It's not pretty out there!

What a crazy "summer" we've had. My heat came on tonight for cryin' out loud!

I know! It's freakin' cold out there. Cold and wet and camping do not go well together. I think we cut out just in the nick of time! Now if it would just clear up for the championship baseball games today.....

We aren't his family and none of this should effect us in a personal way. IMO.

This isn't a career choice. He doesn't have to clairfy himself. The moment Clay posted someting on his website it was all over the news. If he wanted that precious baby to make its way into the world before responding then so be it. It's not a wrong decision if it was the best decision for him.

I don't think anyone has the right to be "disappointed" in what two decent legally adult human beings decide to do with sperm or procreation. It's nobody's damn business but those involved.

Thank you ladies for saying what I am thinking. Bolding and italicizing mine.

I don't think that Parker's birth in August means no chance of some Christmas dates in December. I think maybe Clay was holding off on making a decision one way or the other until he knew everything was going to be ok. I know the stress involved in having a baby, and worrying about all the things that can go wrong. Multiply that a few times over with a high risk pregnancy. I will not be surprised if we hear about some "spot" dates in the near future. Then again, I will also not be surprised if we hear nothing until the gala.

I would love it if he released a family picture of he, Jaymes and baby Parker. I don't expect it, but I don't rule it out either. It would make my heart melt.

[aikim]

Good Morning Everyone,

Ever since the news broke two months ago; I have been trying to understand those who are so disappointed in Clay for this decision and honestly, I still don't understand. I have read post after post on different boards and I still find myself scratching my head. I don't understand those who call themselves Christian can say the things about Clay and Jaymes they do...I am shocked at how judgemental some of his fans are; fans I never would have expected it from. We have had many discussions about how the media treats Clay, but I believe some of his fans are far more insulting and harsh on him than what is said in the media. I know I have said this before, but I will never understand fans who are the same age as Jaymes, who have been smutting and basically lusting after Clay for the past 5 years; using the same prejudices that the media has been spewing about the age of Clay's fans against Jaymes. The only thing I can come up with is that there are fans who are just green with envy...nothing else makes sense to me. And really, we know nothing of Clay and Jaymes's relationship...what happens if we find out they are really married...will those fans who have condemned him for being immoral be able to admit they were wrong...how do you take back harsh words that have been posted on boards for all to see?

Now for some good news!

48 Days until Clay will be partying with Paula!

69 Days until The BAF Gala! !

Everyone have a great day!

Kim

[ivy]

I hear you aikim. After I read you post, I started thinking about family members and friends who are true Christians. They live their beliefs. It is doubtful that I would see any of them writing horrible posts condemning others on the internet.

I don't understand those who call themselves Christian can say the things about Clay and Jaymes they do...I am shocked at how judgemental some of his fans are; fans I never would have expected it from.

My conclusion is that they are not Christians in the true sense of the word. Maybe they go to church but they don't really buy into the precepts of their religion.

The only thing I can come up with is that there are fans who are just green with envy...nothing else makes sense to me. And really, we know nothing of Clay and Jaymes's relationship...what happens if we find out they are really married...will those fans who have condemned him for being immoral be able to admit they were wrong...how do you take back harsh words that have been posted on boards for all to see?

You may be right about why this is happening. I can't figure it out. Harsh words take a toll and are hard to overcome. As OTT as some of the posts were, I can't see these people admitting they were wrong.

I noticed that OMWH is back on AOL. Somehow I missed that they were back but my job is intense right now so I can't read as much as I used to on the boards. I didn't try to play them yet but they were listed again with the length of play time.

[FearofH2O]

And bottle, heee yep sounds very professional. What did that numerologist say about business acumen... so maybe he'll head an accounting firm.

Hush your mouth couchie. I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy. Hopefully Parker will find a less tedious and more monitarily rewarding business to go into.

I can understand those fans not happy with Clay's decisions. Personally I am ecstatic over this since I am so fond of things that make Clay happy. But I won't spend a lot of time trying to convince anyone to agree with me. Some of those people who disagree just keep posting the same thing over and over ad nauseum.

And I really take offense at those calling Clay a liar and wrong wrong wrong without any disclaimer "jmo or ymmv".

And that's jmo. :8:

Thanks for counting down aikim. I must be desperate enough that I'll probably watch Rachel Ray and the View repeats. This technally challanged person is finally getting a dvr so I can replay them over and over. I had forgotten how much I had enjoyed Clay on Scrubs until I watched it on tv last week. :F_05BL17blowkiss:

[Ansamcw]

Disappointments....Its ok to posts about disappointments about Clay...its ok to post about disappointments about fans. These posts will naturally bring about reactions from the readers, its inevitable.

CG...the reactions you were reading are about posts from all over the board. As you said you haven't been reading around the boards yet so maybe you don;t know how vile and ugly some posts have been but I can totally see how they can make a lot of people angry. That is what I can see here...honest reactions. We are all entitled to that.

My reaction... after all the different controversies in this fandom's history, I think the negative reaction to this news is the one that most angered and disappointed me. Not just the reaction to the news itself but the lack of understanding and tolerance some fans had on the way this was handled. I think Clay made it clear why he didn't say anything earlier...he didn't want to tempt fate. That means there was some anxiety about this pregnancy. Its also clear that he wanted to follow what the Foster family wanted...they said they will make a statement after the baby was born. The fact that Clay blogged two hours after the birth of his child is not enough to satisfy people and to me that is disappointing.

WORD to Couchie...the fact that the fans started fighting about this is not really the responsibility of Clay. That is on us...and I think it is sad that this happy news should create such a conflict among his fans.

I would love to see a picture of the happy family but I hope it will be something from the OFC... officially sanctioned by Clay and Jaymes and not something from the paparazzi.

[Cotton]

I feel like I have been having to deal with my own wrongful curiosity and other people's takes on the unknown for far too long now.

<snip> It is possible that Clay got married in a civil ceremony out of this country and we don't know - there would be an explosion if he did. I only state this, not because I need or want this to be a fact, but to indicate that this is one more possiblity in the myriad of possiblities in the great unknown. If it is not the fans barbequeing Clay, it is the media that would find a way of attacking any woman involved with Clay.

Yeah. I have been saying to someone at CV who is "upset", that this is one possibility. I can't understand getting upset when you don't have all the facts. Maybe the thing you're "upset" about isn't even true. We just don't know.

It doesn't matter to me whether there is a marriage. I think what's in the heart is more important than any 'papers' or 'church approval', but that's JMO. I know others feel different.

This is what I can't understand - for this particular poster it would be okay if Jaymes were a mother by anonymous donor. That would not be "out of wedlock", but having a baby with Clay IS "out of wedlock". I can't wrap my mind around that!

Sadly, this is nothing new. I've marveled at people in the church I grew up in who were more than overjoyed to judge other people. What? The one passage in their precious bible that they missed reading was, "Judge not, that ye be not judged."?

That's always been jarringly unbelievable to me.

I have always thought that religious beliefs were supposed to be a guide to help one lead ones own life, not a 2x4 to use against other people as a way to judge their lives!!!

Just mind-boggling.

-So, will no one help me capture Clay saying he is going to sing the extended version of "yes, you are my baby" later? I just need to get the beginning ofthat Clip.

I'd like to hear that, too.

Claygasm, I have to say that reading this newly born baby, Parker, as "the kid" grated on me, too. This is how it feels TO ME - dismissive of a very real baby - with a name. I have no problem with the term 'kid'. I taught 'kids'. 'Kids', being a general term. But used to speak of a particular child, a baby, bothered me. I don't even see Parker as a kid, really. To me, 'kids' walk and talk and run around. *g* Perhaps you didn't feel dismissive when you wrote it. That's just how it felt to me. Also - "the kid" sounds a little different from "his kid". Kind of like some guy saying "the wife" instead of "my wife".

The printed word is hard. We can't hear tone of voice - except the voice in our own heads. So emotion doesn't always translate.

I can understand people feeling conflicted about Clay's new family. But I can't understand anyone categorizing his decision as "wrong". It may not match someone's expectations, but it may be the absolute right thing for him and in his life. And he has all the information. "We" don't. And he knows his own heart. "We" don't.

I trust Clay to make his personal life and career life decisions that are right for him. He may not always make the right choices. I certainly can look back at decisions in my life and see where I might have been better off if I took this path instead of that path. But I made the best choice at the time, knowing what I knew then. Clay has said he's a realist. I think he weighs options. I don't think he makes decisions lightly.

Most of all, I hope he and Jaymes and Parker enjoy the best life they can. The world is full of uncertainty. I'm glad he has love - whatever form it takes - to help him run the minefield of life. :F_05BL17blowkiss:

[KAndre]

Hmm. CG, when you post a big, double-barreled, no hold barred, aggressive defense in a bitchy way, it's bitchy. I'm sure it's how you are feeling, and I admit, I'm a fair distance from empathy with your feelings about this because it doesn't make a smidgen of sense to me. None. I found out yesterday, that my youngest sister is preggers from my mother, in a throwaway conversation. And it didn't cross my mind to be bothered. And I like my sister. And will probably up babysitting the new one, whenever it shows up. I'm sure one of the reasons I feel totally OK with this because I handled my pregnancy as close as possible to the way Clay handled the one he was involved in. As far as I was concerned, it wasn't anyone's who was not directly involved frickin' business. The worst part of my pregnancy was people I didn't know wanting to touch my fucking belly and giving me unsolicited advice. Hell, it STILL pisses me off.

Using "the kid" in the context of your post was dismissive, the same way people elsewhere use "Aiken" when everyone else says "Clay" - and saying it's a legitimate use doesn't make it any less dismissive.

If you're being bitchy, occasionally people will call you on it. I personally find it best to say upfront when I'm being bitchy.

What I've said before is still true:

I said all of that to say this: We expect you to speak your mind, both about Clay and the board, but would like y'all to post in a way to avoid defensiveness on all parts - yours and anyone else's - it makes real communication difficult. It makes posters wary, and we really would like to avoid the wariness that leads to a lot of bad feelings.

[playbiller]

Don't forget that true Christians ran the inquisition. We all interpret Christianity in different ways, much like we interpret all versions of religions differently. I have a friend who is the most liberal of the Conservative Jews. She breaks food rules all the time, but believes in the core of the religion.

[spikesmom]

Cotton, I think I'm going to wander around today following you and just WORD your posts. I read those same posts at CV and wondered about the upset person too. I was taken aback that it would be ok if Jaymes had used an anonymous donor. I definitely do not get that either.

Clearly there are people who are disappointed and are struggling. I'm not having a problem with it but I tend to be a "live and let live" assuming it's not illegal, which it is not. The fans do not have all the facts. There can clearly be more to this than meets the eye or maybe not. But the point is, Clay has absolutely no obligation to tell us anything, nor do I expect him too. I can live with "going with the flow". The situation is what it is.

Clay sounds happy. That's enough for me.

Oh, and I work with someone who goes to church every Sunday and she is very judgemental about how others live their lives. She must have missed the Sunday they talked about it, huh?

[Ansamcw]

Don't forget that true Christians ran the inquisition. We all interpret Christianity in different ways, much like we interpret all versions of religions differently. I have a friend who is the most liberal of the Conservative Jews. She breaks food rules all the time, but believes in the core of the religion.

I don't consider them true Christians either...they are just power hungry people that tried to control how people think. In my view...true Christianity is following Christ example...the guy that made friends with prostitutes and tax collectors.

[annabear]

Oy.

I feel like I have been having to deal with my own wrongful curiosity and other people's takes on the unknown for far too long now.

There are things to be kept in mind before "deciding" an opinion.

1) we don't know Clay, he is a complex human being as we all are.

2) we don't know the details of of Cl;ay's career or life and any opinions are only the vaguest guesses and should not be used to make statements to his career or life. We just don't know.

3) the term I objected to and the persons I would like to see gone are the ones who are using bastard to describe the child. Because a) it is rude and b ) might not legally be described that way and c) it shows what a rude ass that person is. I have also seen Jayes described several ways that are far from complementary. They don't know her, they don't know the situation, so if is presumtive to use those terms and once again shows these people as ignorant of manners.

It is especially offensive on Clay's board. The key is, it is a few people, and they tend to post over and over and over.

About the way it was handled by Clay

1) It is quite possible that it was handled that way it was because of the rude and obnoxious behavior of some fans on the OFC. I am sure that no woman who is connected to Clay will ever get a pass, his mother is vilified, yet the people who know her, love her. She must have some redeeming qualities. It is only the people who don't know her and will never be in the inner circle who dislike her based on random facts.

2) It is quite possible that Clay received advice of the best way to handle this by gasp!!! professional image people. Clayfans are such nosy big mouths, it didn't work the way they forsaw.

I know that most fan groups would like to know things and it would be cool if they could be celebrated and anticipated as others do in the media, but this is Clay with a cafre of women who cut each other down publically all the time and many trash all women in his vicinity for laughs.

I think Clay is constantly between a rock and a hard place in this fandom, there is no way he can ever win. I don't want to kick fans out, I want to help them find some way to accept things. Clay needs his fans and many people are having trouble with the way this wa handled, some are suffering quietly politely, others are more vociferous. And then there are the usual turd stirrers that are completely without honor and don't want a solution.

Tis will be a rough time, I apreciate letting people celebrate, but not everyone is doing that.

It is possible that Clay got married in a civil ceremony out of this country and we don't know - there would be an explosion if he did. I only state this, not because I need or want this to be a fact, but to indicate that this is one more possiblity in the myriad of possiblities in the great unknown. If it is not the fans barbequeing Clay, it is the media that would find a way of attacking any woman involved with Clay.

OK, Play, that's 2 days in a row that a post of your's has made perfect sense to me. Which one of us should be afraid, very afraid?

I think Clay made it clear why he didn't say anything earlier...he didn't want to tempt fate. That means there was some anxiety about this pregnancy. Its also clear that he wanted to follow what the Foster family wanted...they said they will make a statement after the baby was born.

This is an EXCELLENT point regarding how and why communication may have been handled the way it was. Not only is this Clay's personal life, but Jaymes's as well. As much as Parker is Clay Aiken's baby, he's not just his. Lesson # 1 in deciding to bring a new life into the world - almost any decision you make from that moment on no longer affects only you.

I don't blog much anymore, but I ended up going through old blogs at the OFC last night. I came across this one I posted in May 2006. I felt compelled to re-post it and thought I'd subject you to share it here as well.

05/16/06

"Remember, the mind likes to assume it 'knows what it knows', but often its perceptions are just not accurate. Yet strong judgments are made all the time based on limited information...When we judge someone and then adopt an attitude toward them, that shuts down other possibilities and locks us away from the insight of our hearts."

~ Doc Childre and Howard Martin

It amazes me how much truth there is to this quote. So much so that I want to break it down...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Why do some feel it necessary to pick apart and automatically put a negative spin on every.sinlge.thing certain people have to say?

“Remember, the mind likes to assume it 'knows what it knows', but often its perceptions are just not accurate.”

Why do some feel that their opinions on certain topics are superior to others? And long after things have settled, why do some feel the need to keep picking at a scab?

“...strong judgments are made all the time based on limited information...”

Do they even read the words that are on the screen in front of them? Really read them and take into account what the words mean? Or are they completely blinded by their dislike of the screen name under which the words were posted?

“When we judge someone and then adopt an attitude toward them, that shuts down other possibilities and locks us away from the insight of our hearts.”

To those people, I say: Let.It.Go.Already!

Separate your preposterous perceptions (hmmm… say that 3 times fast!) that there must always be some hidden evil in everything they say. Heck - - if you know you’re going to automatically find fault, why are you even wasting time reading what they have to say anyway?

One last question -

Is it truly INCONCEIVABLE that some people are not the monsters you think they are? If your answer is yes, it is INCONCEIVABLE, then I leave you with this bit of wisdom from one of my favorite movies…

"You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."

~ Inigo Montoya

I hope everyone has a good day. The weather here is unusually nice for mid-August, so I think I'm going to skip the rest of the cleaning (the dust bunnies, unfortunately, ain't going anywhere... ) and head out for a while. :F_05BL17blowkiss:

[ivy]

My reaction is probably most similar to K'Andre's. Even when my grown children make decisions that are different than what I would have made, I have never said anything negative to them about their choices. On the contrary, I have told them that they have different backgrounds and experiences and should not look to me to either validate their choices or to condemn them. I am happy to talk pros and cons about their choices but do not even try to hint that their choices are wrong. If asked, I state what my choice would be. It is their lives they are living, not mine. I think DH and I continually surprise our oldest by not sharing confidences with other members of the family. For example, they are expecting a baby. We did not tell anyone, thinking they would like the pleasure of that themselves. So long after they told us, they were surprised to find that my parents, sisters, brother and other family members had not yet been told. I would not have taken away their joy in telling others themselves for any reason.

Does it upset me that people express disappointment in Clay's decision. No, not at all if it is done with respect. But the extreme negative posts that are dismissive, disrespectful, give religious reasons for being upset, and infringe on Clay's and Jayme's right to make their own decisions do bother me. After these people are done with Clay, will they come after me and mine next? Possibly.

[FromClaygary]

Gosh, so many posts from last night and this morning to agree with!!

There are things to be kept in mind before "deciding" an opinion.

1) we don't know Clay, he is a complex human being as we all are.

2) we don't know the details of of Cl;ay's career or life and any opinions are only the vaguest guesses and should not be used to make statements to his career or life. We just don't know.

3) the term I objected to and the persons I would like to see gone are the ones who are using bastard to describe the child. Because a) it is rude and b ) might not legally be described that way and c) it shows what a rude ass that person is. I have also seen Jayes described several ways that are far from complementary. They don't know her, they don't know the situation, so if is presumtive to use those terms and once again shows these people as ignorant of manners.

It is especially offensive on Clay's board. The key is, it is a few people, and they tend to post over and over and over.

Good Lord! Sure glad I don't get to THOSE places!! For the first time ever, I'd be tempted to take out a contract!

And then there are the usual turd stirrers that are completely without honor and don't want a solution.

...and to the second point about turd-stirrers....yes, exactly. Makes me wonder sometimes if some of those are the paparazzi who are there picking up the comments from "fans".

Having said that, I'd still love to see a picture of Baby and Daddy. :F_05BL17blowkiss:

Me too!....and I really think we will, even if it's a while....I don't think, having announced the birth, that he'll be ABLE to keep it to himself!

And bottle, heee yep sounds very professional. What did that numerologist say about business acumen... so maybe he'll head an accounting firm.

....or become the administrator of his Daddy's (by that time) far-flung entertainment conglomerate.

I have to say I haven't read much elsewehere but seeing that judgemental person quoted in the News and Observer pissed me off. I'm not so blunt as Wandacleo but I have to wonder if someone is SO disappointed what is she going to do about the fact that Clay's family unit is something she finds intolerable and how will it manifest itself on whatever board she is on. I don't understand how someone can acknowledge the child will be loved and cared for yet still find that unacceptable. I had a traditional family unit I was an adult-- I would have preferred my mom leave that family unit and take us with her.

Me too....(re the pissed off)....and the reason I posted it is NOT to piss people off, but to point out that as much as we may think the board we are on at that moment is private~it's NOT!!

And here the video Clip where Clay comes out after Jack Black sang yes, that is my baby.

See, he did tellus before TMZ

I think that may indeed have been one of the famous Aiken "slips of the lip" I bet at that point it was HELL for him to contain himself. Jimmy MAY have known as well.

ETA: oops! just realized it was not Kimmel, but Leno~scratch that!

Aikim, I'm completely with you as well! I've been very fortunate to have met two men in my life who were deeply religious, and who I believe truly understand and buy into their faith for a way to live. Clay is one of them. The leaders of the churches I've attended, not so much, unfortunately.

KAndre, I bow to you today as well.

[KAndre]

KAndre simply nods in agreement with annabear...

As for the "Christian" thing on OFC (which is the only place I looked), the first thing that popped into my head was Abraham and Sarah and Hagar and Ishmael.

And then I went and listened to "As Long As We're Here". Man, that's pretty.

[Ansamcw]

Sigh.. I have a feeling I am the lone admin today. Both LdyJ and Couchie are out doing family stuff in RL. SOOOOO that means I need to put up the poll for the title thread.

Any suggestions that is related to this happy event? I hope to put this poll up by this evening so please make your suggestions by then...thanks

[Cotton]

Sigh.. I have a feeling I am the lone admin today. Both LdyJ and Couchie are out doing family stuff in RL. SOOOOO that means I need to put up the poll for the title thread.

Any suggestions that is related to this happy event? I hope to put this poll up by this evening so please make your suggestions by then...thanks

How about we use part of the baby announcement?

(not sure if I'm quoting this directly)

"HE'S HERE and he's a loud as his Daddy is!"

or

"Welcome to the World, Parker Foster Aiken", as someone (I think) suggested yesterday.