claytonic

It makes no sense to you because you see things differently. Some of the clearest examples are made with analogies, where there is no relationship with the actual subject, it works better to remove oneself from the emotional factor and use clear cut examples. ETA: By getting upset or annoyed with a situation I can't control is giving that situation more power than it deserves. And yes, we are all here for fun, the enjoyment of being part of the appreciation of Clay, and that is a choice we make. The more we expend our energy to something negative, the more power we give it. Truly, Clay appears to be well and happy and I choose to allow that to influence my happiness in Clay nation, not the bunch of people that Clay has chosen not to expel. He must have a reason for allowing those people to exist at his official home on the net and I think it is better to accept his choice in the matter and and make the best of it by not reacting to stuff that distorts our experience.

Of course that is true, but why let it bother you, it is THEIR problem, they are living with the misery of having a closed mind and heart. Why allow it to perpetuate the angst in yourself over THEIR problem. I don't see Clay weeping over it, in fact, he appears to be getting on immensely well with the life he wanted for himself. So I take my lead from him and allow people to be who they are, and if they are important to me, I will be there for them IF they want me to be, just as I hope they will be there for me when I hit a bump in the road and get stuck for a while. Recently, I posted MY angst about going to a blog site that covered those photobooth pics, and all the horrible comments that were made. I was upset because I felt they were wrong and unfair and how dare they hurt Clay. I brought my distress into THIS board, and couchie pretty much said (paraphrasing) sh*t comments happen, she reminded me that I frequent YouTube and I read stuff about Obama, and that was very true, it's the same thing. I could drive myself crazy being upset with some of the things I get sent about Obama but unless I know the person and know I can have a decent exchange of communication with them, thrash their email. I also realized that there will ALWAYS and FOREVER be people who don't like Clay and nothing anyone says or does will change that, I am talking about people who have some kind of agenda about hating Clay, not the people who don't like him just because they prefer heavy metal or something.... When I stopped reading those comments, I stopped having anything to feel protective about regarding Clay. Clay is the last person I need to worry about, in fact, yet again, he has shown me in his subtle way, what matters, and what truly doesn't. It is all about choices and those of us living in the developed world have many choices, even though it doesn't always seem that way.

...especially the bolded part! Ah you see, you are expecting them to be the same as you, and in a perfect world, that is how it would be, with everyone sharing the same values. It isn't a perfect world, and I am not perfect by a long shot and I cannot think of anyone who is close to it even if they have qualities that I am in awe of. Not even Mother Teresa who had her own agenda on certain issues that created a furore with certain groups. Yet she appeared to be selfless, the epitome of compassion. Everyone is different, and for me, this situation with the troubled Clay fans is really a non-event compared to problems most of us have at home in some shape or form. Right now, for me to think about being upset with anyone who isn't loving Clay in a balanced way "like I am", I only have to think about the people who burned to death last week, and to think of their family and friends who are left with nothing but the clothes on their backs, and to think of the emergency people (the equivalent of your 911) who listened to the screams of terror from people calling from their cell phones, to the emotional state of a mother who got a call from her 21 year old son who, clutching his girlfriend, died on the phone saying goodbye to his mother. Some things CAN be simple if we put things into perspective.

luckiest1, can you give us the author of Crisis? I'd like to recommend that book to my friend, sounds like it may help her. (I am not a member of OFC, when I first tried to join, I had difficulty, I think they had closed at that time or something. Then when I was able to join, I was reading - on here - about all the stuff going on there and I decided I didn't want to be in a position where I could be tempted to read those posts. Maybe that is why I am not really affected by them. I dunno for sure....)

I understand what you are saying .. to a "typical" fan, it is a simple problem that has a simple solution, and that is why I used the "food issues" analogy because it isn't about food, and it isn't about Clay. They do need therapy but like a lot of people who do need therapy, they don't see it that way or don't want to see it that way, everyone has their own agenda in terms of the painful stuff in their life. As couchie (I think) pointed out... the subscription renewal to OFC will be revealing, and possibly there will be some who still need to come back and continue their angst. That's their problem, though, and it only becomes our problem if we allow it to be and in a way, we are allowing it to continue to affect us just as they have allowed Clay's coming out to continue to affect them in a personal way. Everyone has a choice to step back and look the other way. If what they are looking for is attention ... then wouldn't it be best if we didn't acknowledge them? The OFC also has the power to make decisions, to NOT renew their subscription or delete their posts or ignore them altogether.

That's how they function, it's their way to deal with it ... it really isn't about Clay at all and I suspect Clay knows that.

Some Elvis fans are just very loyal, devoted and a credit to his memory! They have a knack for recognizing class and talent personified and that's why they are also Clay fans! Seriously ... with the fans that seem to be stuck in their misery and confusion over how they feel about Clay ... there just isn't any way we can possibly empathize in a meaningful way. The most obvious analogy to me would be like saying to someone who is dangerously obese - "geez, use common sense, just eat less and exercise more..." ... or saying to someone who has anorexia "snap out of it willya...eat properly like everyone and stop all that stupid exercise". What is readily visible is just a symptom of their condition, those of us who don't have a serious issue with food could/would never understand them. Some things don't have a simple solution, and don't have anything to do with intelligence or even common sense. Unconditional love and acceptance is what is needed in this instance and unfortunately, some parents don't even have the ability to just open their arms and hearts and simply accept without judgment because they are too worried about what "people will think", and so they have their own issues that aren't necessarily visible either.

I didn't miss your point at all. My point was that she did not have to support her son either, and where this fandom is concerned, the lines seem to have blurred between family and pop star. The way some fans are with Clay, it seems Clay is more important to them than their own kids or DH. Shortly after Clay came out, I read what some fans said about how they had neglected their families because they spent so much time and money on Clay. Some of the members of this fandom are very unusual, we don't know what they are thinking when they put a pop star ahead of their own kids. Clearly, it isn't a simple situation like "oh well, now that I know he's gay, I have lost interest". It is as if Clay had cast some kind of "spell" (I am exaggerating but this best describes the situation) on them because it has paralyzed them. I don't understand their "paralysis" just as I don't quite understand why some fans live and breathe for Clay. I love Clay and never miss an opportunity to talk about him or play his songs or watch his videos, but he's not my life.

The difference is, this is this woman's son. She can't just walk away because she 'doesn't understand'. We don't have to 'deal with it'. She does. These 'fans' can walk away, but instead choose to stay around and beat up a (im)perfect stranger. That speaks to their character, not Clay's. Too bad the rest of us have to read it. These are fan boards - seems like there should be at least a loose definition there - and there should be a point when you realize that you just aren't a fan of the man any more. Move on. Well, she COULD have tossed him out, some parents STILL do that, not just for their child being gay but for other reasons as well. Not all parents support their kids unconditionally. Well, I no longer read posts that slam Clay, it is a choice I have made because it made me so angry. Or if I start reading something and it looks like it is less than flattering to Clay, I don't continue. As I said, everyone is different, they obviously still need to vent and perhaps they need to create their own forum. The only thing I can do about it is not read it, and I also feel really and truly sorry for the fans who are obviously so miserable now because they can't let it go. Their choice has made them unhappy but I am not going to let them make me unhappy too. ETA: Actually. it was couchie's advice to NOT read those unflattering comments, and it was the best advice.

Everyone deals with situations like this differently. I have a friend who still struggles with the fact that her son has revealed that he is gay. She loves him and externally, she has accepted it but it is a different story internally... she just doesn't understand homosexuality, it puzzles her... despite the fact that she has had a few years to come to terms with it. She is a mature, intelligent and well-educated woman who was very aware of the world around her but when it came to her son, it shook her to the core. Oh, and she's a staunch Catholic with a heart that is filled with compassion for other people. It's like that brilliant movie "Guess Who's Coming to Dinner"... it can be applied to so many other prejudices. When it's something so close to home, it challenges you in a way no one can possibly understand unless they are wearing your shoes. Religion is a strange thing though, I am tempted to go there but it is bound to raise some hackles!

I've been thinking about this "phenomenon", and the only thing I can come up with is the "can't live with or without him" syndrome. I also think that perhaps those who are having the greatest difficulty is because they had made Clay the center of their universe, whereas I think that most fans were able to move forward because they already had/have a life without Clay and Clay is the bonus, he enhances their life but he isn't their whole life. That's the only sense I can make of it because really, in a way, Clay is to some sorta like what Elvis was to his "crazed" fans in his day. To this day, there are Elvis fans (some OLD ladies!) who really DO think he is still alive, and those who accept he is dead, have shrines and Elvis special days etc. I consider it harmless, as long that it doesn't affect Clay or anyone else in a negative way. Carolina Clay that grandson of yours is indeed absolutely adorable!

Well, that “freestyle cooking” is great, actually, and I generally do that myself but I also like to look at recipes to get ideas about ingredients. Food has evolved so much…whereas once upon a time I would stick to how something was supposed to be done, I am now more creative but within the guidance of a recipe because, unfortunately, I don’t have a natural flair for cooking. Food is such a critical part of life, anything that we can learn that helps us to get excited about combining fresh ingredients to produce an amazing flavor can only be a good thing. That’s why I have so many garden pots growing organic herbs and vegetables. It took a bit of trial and error but the success I now have makes my hobby very worthwhile and great fun! Practically any kind of health issue can be treated, at least in part, with good nutrition. It certainly helped me recover from Epstein Barr Virus, which was absolutely debilitating.

I have to agree, that is now my favorite recipe site. I have checked through most of the soup recipes because soup's my big thing in winter - cook and freeze healthy meal portions. Some of the ingredients I am still checking out as they aren't familiar to me but I'll definitely be cooking up a storm with that site! Thanks for sharing the site, annabear!

Someone in the UK told me that she'd read about the fans who were taking Clay to court for injured feelings (when he came out). Is this TRUE? I don't remember reading about this here and I haven't been to other boards for months. The only reason I am asking this question is because we keep hearing about the most bizarre cases, for example ... that woman who spilled hot coffee on herself and sued McDonalds and WON! So to me, anything is possible in America!!!

The stories are FAN.FAN.FANtastic!! In fact, too good - I think - to be left in a thread that will, in a matter of time, be locked. Just a suggestion... what about creating a special thread that is pinned, and called "He is.. therefore I fan". Wouldn't it be great to have this title kept "alive" indefinitely? This thread could be exclusively for these historical stories on "how I got to be a Claymate,Clayzyfan, ClayFan". Members could then ETA, EATA and EYATA to their heart's content, fine-tuning their stories and adding pics and YouTube vids where relevant. I love it when I read about a certain tour, and then find there is a specific video on YT re the banter or song mentioned. If one of these stories is significantly edited, then it is just a matter of alerting the main thread about it so anyone who is interested could go and check it out and argue that THAT's not how THEY remember it!! . Perhaps ... one day a hard-copy print-out could be made of the stories, and sent to Clay on a special anniversary. The "book title" seems obvious... ETA: Tragedy sure brings out the best and worst in people. THE WORST Everyone in Oz has been touched by the bushfire tragedy, which continues with 29 fires still burning and the dead being located in the rubble that used to be houses that were once homes. If someone came door-knocking asking for donations for the victims, would you say yes? People have been conned into giving donations to opportunists, fraudulently collecting money on behalf of the fire victims. Unbelievable, isn't it, taking advantage of a tragedy? From what I understand, they didn't get far before they were caught. I would never make donations to anyone or anything that wasn't a known authorised charity. And I'd never do it via a door-knock. THE BEST We, as a country, have raised over $57 million so far, and there's more being donated all the time. That's pretty impressive for a country with a population of only 21 million and where many people have lost their jobs or are struggling due to the world economic downturn. We have a telethon right now and everyone is there, not just the usual entertainers in the performing arts but our Olympic athletes and every big name business, despite the fact they are feeling the pinch as well. We are also getting moral, emotional and financial support from pretty much every Australian living or working abroad at the moment, so we know they are with us in spirit. I am so proud to be Australian right now. Leonard Cohen has been touring here in Oz and had his last concert date in Melbourne on Feb 10. I read that he had to come out of retirement to tour because someone he entrusted his life earnings to had mismanaged or robbed him of his funds. Whatever the case, he has donated A$200,000 (approx US$130,000). Somehow that really touched me.

Ever since I first saw Clay's photobooth pics, I've been trying to think of who they remind me of and, finally, it has dawned that he reminds me of a young Dustin Hoffman (excluding HEIGHT!!!!!!) I was telling someone that Clay has numerous boards, certainly more than any other artist that I am aware of. I was asked "how many" and I said, off the top of my head, um way more than 50, and that wouldn't even include the ones that started and stopped. Would I be right in saying that?

It is easily my favorite thread title. I was looking at it a couple of days ago He is ... therefore I fan and I suddenly realised what the 3 dots stood for. He is therefore I fan. I am planning on buying a Japanese fan, and pasting a pic of Clay, with the thread title. (I know I said I don't collect merchandise but this will be a useful item when the temperatures climb). Liney, you could design your own TShirt with the thread title where you want it to be. There's quite a few shops here that will put your chosen pic on a Tshirt, pretty much what the audience gets made for their favorite contestant in programs like Idol. The biggest problem will be choosing the pic... there are so many to choose from!

If you have email addresses for friends and relatives living in Australia, please could you forward this message to them: THANK YOU

I am also thinking of the irony of this situation; no rain where it is needed and far too much in the extreme opposite direction. It is why I mentioned in a previous post that I didn't understand why there isn't a law that stipulates all new houses have large rainwater-tanks under the house or backyard, so that the collection of rain water might reduce the impact of either drought and flood. Also that solar panels aren't compulsory for new houses when the summer months mean a strain on power resources due to excessive use of air-conditioners; thus causing power failure. We have heat-wave conditions and bush fires every.single.summer; it's not like it's a new thing and we don't know how to reduce the risk of consequences. I am finding the news very distressing, I can hardly breathe from the images of all that destruction and the devastation on the faces of the victims. And we don't even see the worst of it because they obviously can't physically show the growing numbers of the dead. Then there's scores of those who didn't lose their lives but are in hospital with horrendous burn injuries that have been described as worse than the injuries from the Bali bombing in October 2002. Under normal circumstances, the floods up north would be considered a disaster too but the impact of the flooding seems insignificant when contrasted against the rolling inferno down south.

Thanks, Fear. While it is very hot where I am, at least I can cool down in various ways when it gets somewhat unbearable. I am NOT in the southern states where catastrophic destruction (to property and lives) continues, nor am I in the northern part of my state where they are battling floods. I am thankful that I have a roof over my head and dry floors, but it is hard not to think about those who are devastated and feel that I should be doing something to help. That must have been amazing live. Those Clayzy people in the audience are something special - it's a huge compliment to Clay when the audience knows all the words to his songs (not that he'd expect any less, I am sure!). ETA: Scroll alert: Fires disaster in Oz While I am not naive enough to be surprised that firebugs (arsonists) are involved, it is just beyond comprehension that this is something that was done deliberately and for FUN, for kicks. I watched a forensic psychiatrist say that these firebugs are addicts, they have a compulsive disorder not unlike those with a fixation to drugs, alcohol, cigarettes or another substance they cannot stop thinking about. Apparently some don't really want to harm people, but others actually count the death toll and extent of destruction as a mark of their achievement and heatwave conditions are what they look forward to with great anticipation. They relight fires that have been controlled; some are even volunteers! The devastation is just shocking, scores of people dead, six members from one family perished and some towns no longer exist. completely burnt to the ground. It's reportedly the worst in our history. Please pray (if you believe in prayer) for the victims and their families, or send good thoughts and healing light our way. Thanks.

Aikim, every day now as I look at your countdown to Spring, I can't help looking forward to Autumn and Winter at my end, at least for the southern states of Australia. Just saw a news update and things are looking pretty grim with homes and lives being lost in the worst heat/fire conditions in history. People and animals trapped. Parts of Victoria reportedly at 48ºC (118.4ºF) http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/02/07/2485270.htm

Carol Thatcher was this week dropped from her roving reporter role on "The One Show", the main BBC1 television channel's daily prime time topical programme,

Yup, it's a guaranteed way to get someone to agree with me .... AND to demonstrate a level of clayziness that qualifies me to be a member of Clay boards....

From the CANN site: Clay is #1 The Many Looks of TV Clay ETA: How do I get rid of that extra space under my sig? EATA: OK, just because I asked the question, most of the extra space is gone, but still not quite all gone... EYATA: So... looks like my post was too short, and that meant blank space under my sig? (With these ETAs added, the blank space is gone)

I received an email from one of the "shy lurkers" who, like me, is acronym challenged! Just wanted to let the Mod Squad here know how much this board is appreciated by the silent visitors. I will be updating the Glossary shortly to include: ETA = Edited To Add EATA = Edited Again To Add EYATA = Edited Yet Again To Add If anyone wants anything added, please email me as soon as possible (email address on the Glossary). I know the Glossary isn't the prettiest site but honestly, I've given up trying to get all the fonts to be uniform because Google Page Creator has a mind of its own and throws a fit if I don't use the right browser on the right day of the week or something - it is clearly male!! It's frustrating for a perfectionist like me but the main thing, I guess, is that it is functional.