#24: Somewhere out there Clay is looking cute and talking with an accent and practicing a dance.

[Cotton]

One of the other things that makes me sad it the state of the media

Play, I just pulled this one sentence from your post.

I was talking with my Sis last night. She retired from teaching. Worked for 8+ years in another field, went back to teaching. Today is her last day of teaching. 2 1/2 years was all she could take. Things we were bemoaning.

Schools are not happy places.

Students love to get in each other's faces. Pick out what's wrong with others. Principals don't stand up to parents. Don't stand up for teachers.

And - the disrespect is UN.BE.LIEVE.ABLE.

If we had talked to parents/teachers/adults the way these young people do, we'd have been stripped of every possible privilege, allowance, etc. And no one has expectations of them. They aren't held accountable.

I said to Sis. I'm worried about our country. This tabloidism has permeated every corner of our society. Laughing at pain. Digging for the nasty - The negative - The sleezy - The worst in people has become the norm.

I seriously worry for our children growing up in this atmosphere where emotional hurt is a sport.

I think what we see that Clay has to put up with is just one example of a cancer that has become so established I wonder if we will ever come out from under it.

I think I'll go hug Droopy. He's much nicer that a lot of people!

I'll shut up now and step off this box I'm standing on.

OTOH, I'm really looking forward to seeing Quiana next weekend and her BFF in March!

[playbiller]

If you want to get into a political discussion without taking sides - I am the person. People I know make me want to scream. I know they are nice people with good hearts and yet I am not allowed to bering up things like facts in a political discussion,they want to talk about stuff that is more on the seemy side. It is like it facts are not important, only tittilation is important (I know Clay fans so well). They listen to talk radio and accept every crappy thing they hear as fact, they do not want to hear about the international press or the the financial state of the country. I am gbeginning to see tha it is as if this is all too hard for them. I have educated friends that I have enjoyed talking to in the past, but now they just want to talk about Britney. I feel quite alone in thinking that the politics around us is important to our future and our survival as an intelligent organism. This does not mean that there is not the exception on each side, jsut that the brains of people I see are very strange.

I have talked about some one I know who is and always has been very strange. But she used to live in the world of facts a medical researcher. Since she was laid off and got heavily involved wth one of these strange back channel Catholic groups, I quetion everything out of her mouth, We have nothing to talk about because I can't keep my mouth open so much in the winter. She has become, among many odd things, an anti-evolution person, with her masters in nursing and anatomy. She has become for a laying on of hands and against any medical procedures or medication, even though she supervised many drug trials in her job. I do think it might have to do with some form of senility but it just seems odd and does go along with the beliefs of the people she "hangs" with currently.

Maybe it is that people I know are getting older although they do vary in age from 20'sto 70's, but I really do believe we are seeing the dumbing down of America. Maybe I should go watch "I Luv New York" again to convince me I am on the right path with others. Or maybe catch another episode of Frontline to convincemy self I am not.

[Marilyon98]

I would like to share a really special post from Brighstar at CV- I love it!!:

I think Clay is a big ol' smorgasboard of amazing talent. Once in a lifetime talent, in my book. If you don't like the big-voiced glory note songs (which I bet he will always include--I think he loves singing them), he can offer a soft-voiced, nuanced, stab-you-right-in-the-heart-when-you-least-expect it song. If you don't like his original pop songs, he can deliver an oldie in a way that will make you forever forget who sang it first. If you don't care for rock-tinged songs, he will sing a bluesie, soulful number. Want uptempo? He's there. Want a strong ballad? He's got it. Want a soft, tender ballad, yep, it's on the way. Love to hear spiritual music? Clay can transport you as he sings to his God.

Maybe you enjoy a little naughty humor now and then. Just attend a few concerts. Prefer family-friendly? It's there in spades. Want a classy, beautiful experience? Hope you checked out CITH. Love a comic with great timing? He's that too. Acting? Clay has real talent there that has yet to be fully explored. Like to watch a man move and dance with natural rhythm? Despite all he says, Clay clearly can move and dance ---the music draws out his natural rhythm.

Perhaps you enjoy a good, intelligent conversation. Then Clay's your man. Do you look for a humble, down to earth personality? That's Clay for sure. Want a person who cares about others, a celebrity who seriously tries to make a difference in the world? Take a look at Clay, who started his foundation quickly and hopefully as his career sprung from his spotlight. Do you want a man who is knowledgable about the world, who cares about those in other countries? Check out UNICEF's cutest ambassador. Smart, funny, clever, quick, caring, humble, thoughtful, ambitious, realistic, and mad, mad, talented---he's all that and more.

There's something there for everyone. They just have to look.

Now he's far from perfect, as is the case for each of us. But he is so very, very talented, so very, very sincere and real and good and genuine. A smorgasboard, not just of talent, but of hope and dreams and effort. How can I not love him?

Oh, and if you kinda like good singing and acting and dancing and comedy and great timing and naughty humor, all given with a 100% effort, there's a great Broadway show you might want to check out around Jan 18....

[muskifest]

Popping in and caught this from Cotton:

Today is her last day of teaching. 2 1/2 years was all she could take. Things we were bemoaning.

Schools are not happy places.

Students love to get in each other's faces. Pick out what's wrong with others. Principals don't stand up to parents. Don't stand up for teachers.

And - the disrespect is UN.BE.LIEVE.ABLE.

If we had talked to parents/teachers/adults the way these young people do, we'd have been stripped of every possible privilege, allowance, etc. And no one has expectations of them. They aren't held accountable.

I taught senior high school English from 1977-1984 in a rural community in Delaware. I also did substitute teaching here in California from 2002-2004 or so. Before subbing in a high school, I had actually considered going back to teaching. One day was all it took for me to realize that I'd never make it now. I'd be in jail or be assaulted by some kid or parent, no doubt.

Although I saw the same 'phenonenon" of

Principals don't stand up to parents. Don't stand up for teachers.

30 years ago (30 years? Holy shit! I'm older than Eve! ), I have to say how sadly true it is that the respect issue among the students HAS changed since I was spending day after day with them. With all the bullshit that existed in the school where I taught, there was not the pervasive sense of "FUCK IT ALL!" that seems to rule in many schools today. I don't see respect for each other, for the teachers or parents or---and this is the most disturbing element---for themselves. It's simply and utterly a frightening environment in those hallways!

Gotta go....so much work...

[skybar22]

Playbiller, I agree with much of what you are saying. It is very strange for me to have grown up as a boomer and to see the state of our nation today. I can barely be out in the world without wondering what is in the water these days. I won't do politics here but I remain so undecided because I DO believe this is one of the most important elections in my lifetime and I hope we get it right, if that is even possible anymore.

[JennaZ]

RE: Message boards. I sometimes get infuriated by things I read on message boards, even here. When that happens, I just back away. Some people love a good fight, but I'm not one of them. I have decided that I will not let message board drama become my life. I have a job. I have a husband. And as much as I love Clay, he's not the center of my universe. I sometimes wonder if some of the extreme positions of some posters are the result of too deep an emotional investment in this fandom. These conspiracy theories anger me, but they also make me sad, because I can't help but think that at some level, these people have lost a sense of real world perspective.

Cotton, I'm sorry your sister has become so disillusioned with teaching. My husband is a teacher, and though he has worked at places that have been dispiriting, he is currently at a charter school that has re-invigorated his career. It isn't perfect, and the kids can occasionally be disrespectful (they are, after all, teenagers), but he does get satisfaction from his work and he is appreciated, by both students and the administration. Teaching isn't always a negative experience for everyone. There are places and people who can make it worthwhile.

[playbiller]

Isn't this just like a recent quote from Clay? About parents not listening to teachers. Although Ido recall having some teachers where parents should have stood up for their kids, Like a first grade teacher who put something my brother's record that and that followed him until the sunshine laws were put in effect and my mother found finally found it and had it removed, but not before severe damage was done to my brother that foisted a hatred of school.

Then there were warning signs that were never addressed because parents did not listen to teachers, Like the bullies in school. Ihve been looking for volunteer work, but the only things I have been offered were in schools where the new reports volunteers getting attacked. Gee, wonder why they will take anyone? Part of it is parents runnning all atrround with their kids not having time, the other part is believing they have to support their kids - a middle ground has to be found - i.e. support your kids acedemically but address behavior problems. I don't envy teachers.

[skybar22]

RE: Message boards. I sometimes get infuriated by things I read on message boards, even here. When that happens, I just back away. Some people love a good fight, but I'm not one of them. I have decided that I will not let message board drama become my life. I have a job. I have a husband. And as much as I love Clay, he's not the center of my universe. I sometimes wonder if some of the extreme positions of some posters are the result of too deep an emotional investment in this fandom. These conspiracy theories anger me, but they also make me sad, because I can't help but think that at some level, these people have lost a sense of real world perspective.

ITA that some have totally lost it and are so enmeshed and entangled in the messes they create that it rules their lives. I have been on a Clay board where I could not believe the degree of obsession and inability to lighten up and enjoy the man rather than defend him and fight their fights. It can really distort one's perspective. With Clay, I take him at his word and I mean that in the sense of how he is doing too. I think we have all seen him upset but he has moved on. He took his life back and look at where he is now. I can only be happy for him and respect his directives about how he would like his fans to proceed. But what I have come to realize is that the Internet fandom is a large community and most of the fans are just enjoying the man while a minority are all caught up in defending him or believing in conspiracies. It's my guess that they may do this in other areas of their lives as well. This so called Clay Nation has it all, the crazies included.

[wandacleo]

The horses have been beaten, the people flayed, and the dogs have howled.

Enough.

(Doing little dance and humming joyfully when thinking about Clay)

I just want to CELEBRATE!!!!

[KAndre]

See, I don't worry about Clay that way as I watch the new Hannah Montana "scandal" - a body double in concert. Man, I thought lip-syncing was bad!

[skybar22]

See, I don't worry about Clay that way as I watch the new Hannah Montana "scandal" - a body double in concert. Man, I thought lip-syncing was bad!

Is this for real? OMG!

[playbiller]

What is the body double doing?

Is that what they call all those people on Disney shows where they wear a mask to look like Cinderella and the music is lipsynced so they Cinderellas all look and sound the same?

[soulsista4clay]

I just saw a episode of "my super sweet sixteen," And I am so sorry, but i HATE those girls and boys on there with a burning flame of disiare, I cannot not stand them! I hate the fact that the girls on there get to have a happy party at the end. I also hate the fact that they get everything they want and that they are spoiled as heck.

Throw the tomatoes than cause some of the girls and boys on that show annoy me, one little girl ( i have a worst name to call her) got a street closed with a hospital and she said that the amblance could take a detur and it was her party and stuff.

edit this all you want but that is how i fell, maybe I am a jelous 18 year old or something. And i wanna vent.

[KAndre]

The article on MSNBC

The body double apparently pops up so "Hannah" can go change into whatever her real name is, because apparently she has a set as "herself". The whole thing seems complicated.

No editing, because I can't stand the people on "My Super Sweet Sixteen" or "Bridezillas" - though I really dislike the parents because they enable all that crap. No, you really aren't a frickin' princess, you twit. None of you!

[JennaZ]

Doesn't seem like a big deal to me...

A video posted on YouTube shows the 15-year-old entertainer as "Hannah" dancing onstage with a group of dancers and the Jonas Brothers, also on the tour. During the song, someone ushers her offstage via a trap door. Immediately, another girl dressed like the character "Hannah" in the same pink trench coat with blonde hair covering her faces dances around, runs up the stage set, and then quickly leaves.

While the double is holding a microphone for her less than a minute, the girl motions like she is singing. However, a rep for Miley said the switch was only for costume purposes.

"To help speed the transition from Hannah to Miley, there is a production element during the performance of 'We Got the Party' incorporating a body double for Miley," according to statement Friday from the public relations firm PMK.

"After Hannah has completed the featured verse on the duet with the Jonas Brothers, a body double appears approximately one to two minutes prior to the end of the song in order to allow Miley to remove the Hannah wig and costume and transform into Miley for her solo set. Other than during this very brief transitional moment in the show, Miley performs live during the entirety of both the Hannah and Miley segments of the concert."

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5giOBXmQ...DNO3IwD8U3SFI00

[KAndre]

I just don't see why it's even necessary. What's the point? Is one minute of a lack of "Hannah" going to kill the teenies? And I admit, I find it hard to believe they would drag a body double around the country for a grand total of one minute on stage - I think they just haven't been caught yet.

[FearofH2O]

One of the reasons I don't post very much anywhere is my inclination to defend anyone who is being brow beaten. I have defended Presidents that I haven't voted for because of the ganging up tactics. I don't send out emails to writers of unfair articles or bloggers, but I do try to stick up for Clay when he is ,IMO, being unjustly criticized. An example of this is name calling. Playbiller can tell you that this just pushes my buttons. My one exception is calling liars- liars.

My biggest complaint in the world as it is, is the total lack of thinking for oneself. This is what has amazed me in this fandom. Certain seld-appomnted leaders telling others what to think. The whole RCA fiasco was a prime example of this. I was edited whenever I posted that I didn't believe what they said had occurred. I questioned why certain poster could express their points of view and why others including myself could not. For some reason my posts were always talking about the boards or insulting the poster. I decided it's much easier to lurk.

[Clayzorback]

RE: Message boards. I sometimes get infuriated by things I read on message boards, even here. When that happens, I just back away. Some people love a good fight, but I'm not one of them. I have decided that I will not let message board drama become my life. I have a job. I have a husband. And as much as I love Clay, he's not the center of my universe. I sometimes wonder if some of the extreme positions of some posters are the result of too deep an emotional investment in this fandom. These conspiracy theories anger me, but they also make me sad, because I can't help but think that at some level, these people have lost a sense of real world perspective.

Cotton, I'm sorry your sister has become so disillusioned with teaching. My husband is a teacher, and though he has worked at places that have been dispiriting, he is currently at a charter school that has re-invigorated his career. It isn't perfect, and the kids can occasionally be disrespectful (they are, after all, teenagers), but he does get satisfaction from his work and he is appreciated, by both students and the administration. Teaching isn't always a negative experience for everyone. There are places and people who can make it worthwhile.

I agree JeannaZ. Speaking of teachers and education. What really amazes me, is the fact that a lot of Clay's OTT fans are teachers. Also, a lot of the fake Clay and back channel believers are educators. Scary isn't it?

I personally don't get the Hannah Montana, AKA, Miley Cirus lovefest.

[skybar22]

I just don't see why it's even necessary. What's the point? Is one minute of a lack of "Hannah" going to kill the teenies? And I admit, I find it hard to believe they would drag a body double around the country for a grand total of one minute on stage - I think they just haven't been caught yet.

I think you are right on. I wonder what they get away with on TV.

[Cotton]

I don't see respect for each other, for the teachers or parents or---and this is the most disturbing element---for themselves. It's simply and utterly a frightening environment in those hallways!

Exactly. I didn't finish my thought.

The blow back from the lack of expectations, accountability is the message.

And the message is - "you are not worth our effort".

Sadly the message that many of our students get is that they are expected . . .

not to do homework

not to try there hardest

not to try to achieve

not to learn to be tolerant of every person

not to pay attention in class

not to put in any effort

Instead of encouraging them and expecting them to listen, read, study, learn. Instead of making school and learning the energetic, stimulating fun it can be, we're making it a battle!

It's a sad, sad situation.

ETA:

Just to clarify, Sis taught for 33 years, retired and returned for 2 1/2 more years.

She just decided that she wasn't happy going to work each morning. Her kids weren't happy. And she could no longer figure out how to fix it.

I'm glad for her. She's starting a new venture at 63. And I know how hard it is in the trenches. I'm not "retired", strictly speaking, as I'm not getting retirement pay yet. I needed to put in 8 more years, but I just couldn't stick it out.

It's hard to explain to folks who haven't lived public school life. I know there are 'pockets' where there are good programs. But - sadly, I think overall, our education system is in the toilet and teachers are expected to work miracles with no resources. And teachers are less respected that sanitation workers when they should be honored.

That's one of the reasons I kind of chuckle when I hear Clay say he still has this fantasy of going back to teaching. I don't think he could stand the BS, frankly!

[KAndre]

I guess I'm one of those tend to think the focus on "fun" is a mistake - things can be enjoyable and satisfying without being "fun" - I think we have done ourselves a disservice in not pushing a little more "suck it up", "this too shall pass", "not all good things in life are fun."

[jumpingjacks]

I've been a SpEd teacher for 26 years...the last 15 have been with kids with behavioral disorders. I can't imagine ever doing anything else. It isn't the kids or the parents who are my worst nightmare...it's other teachers.

By the way, I didn't believe any of the back channel bullshit nor am I an insider. I don't feel comfortable being grouped with that bunch of nutbars.

[Clayzorback]

I just don't see why it's even necessary. What's the point? Is one minute of a lack of "Hannah" going to kill the teenies? And I admit, I find it hard to believe they would drag a body double around the country for a grand total of one minute on stage - I think they just haven't been caught yet.

That does sound like it would be expensive.

Fun is over rated. :thbighug-1:

[playbiller]

I guess I'm one of those tend to think the focus on "fun" is a mistake - things can be enjoyable and satisfying without being "fun" - I think we have done ourselves a disservice in not pushing a little more "suck it up", "this too shall pass", "not all good things in life are fun."

Is this like when people want their kids to like them so they give them wnat ever they want? Shades of last week's wife swap where the family had a perminent Christmas tree and gave their daughter a gift every day.

While not everything needs to be fun, some things can be more fun if you take a fun attitude about it (not scrubbing floors!) or can be more miserable if you complain the whole time - like waiting on lines where I have met some interesting people and the line itself became part of the event as long as who ever I was with did not whine. - example waiting in Bryant Park line for GMA

ETA - I imagine being a SpeEd teacher gives you a different kind of parent, one whois aware of the problem - that goes for Clay as well. Although he was quite clear on unsuportive parents.

[Clayzorback]

I've been a SpEd teacher for 26 years...the last 15 have been with kids with behavioral disorders. I can't imagine ever doing anything else. It isn't the kids or the parents who are my worst nightmare...it's other teachers.

By the way, I didn't believe any of the back channel bullshit nor am I an insider. I don't feel comfortable being grouped with that bunch of nutbars.

I don't believe I lumped you or all teachers in with the nutbars. I said a lot of fans who are teachers. Not all fans who are teachers.