bottlecap Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 I had no problem with Ethel's "It's all good" the other night in Merrillville, because it seemed to me to be perfectly in keeping with the moment, and my take is that Clay appreciated it. Having read the post by the woman who was trying, as far as I can tell, to discretely tell Clay he might be going to have a wardrobe malfunction last night, I don't have a problem with that either. The drunken-sounding shouting I heard on the cell-stream last night? Not so much. Planning things to try to get Clay's attention? Just say "NO." No forcing of the moment, no annoying fame-whoring "Pick Me!" "Notice Me!" behaviour, which is where I can see the whole schtick going. I trust Clay to be funny and quick, I just don't trust some fans to rein it in when appropriate. YMMV, of course, and my opinions are all Clack-based since I won't be going to a concert myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claygasm Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 I have been trying to read all the posts at the CH concerning public posting of clack and whether or not to "censor" it or to have guidelines or just leave it up to the discretion of the clack gatherers. I vote for the last choice as in the end, the clack is theirs and they should decide what happens with it. Of course, anyone can download any piece of clack and use it anyway they want, but what's the alternative? Only have clack available in vaults that most of the fandom has no access to? So some dumb ass DJs got hold of the Waukegan AIW clack and made fun of Clay. Boo hoo. This doesn't bother me in the least. First, so what? Consider the audience these types of DJs play to. Are they ever likely to become Clay fans? Probably not. And so people find out Clay can once in awhile sings a bad note. Big whoop. Why is that the end of the world? Clay is NOT perfect. He has made mistakes before and will again. Why do people in this fandom feel they have to keep these mistakes a secret from the rest of the world? DJs, media types and slugs have been making fun of Clay, spreading rumors about Clay, saying nasty things about Clay since the beginning. They don't need a piece of clack to do it. If the Waukegan clack had never surfaced, do you think they wouldn't have found something else to use to make fun of him? I think some in the fandom just have to accept that no matter how hard they try to clayvert the entire world, not everyone is going to like him. Most will probably just feel indifferent toward him. Some may just not like his "type" of music, or his sound. And that's ok. Doesn't make them idiots or mean they have no taste. They just have a different taste. Some will for whatever reason hate Clay. So let them. Clay can handle it. And the fans, IMO, should just ignore them and not let the haters get to them. More times than not they are just trying to get attention and more times than not this fandom gives them exactly what they are looking for. I don't ever want to see someone afraid to share their clack in case some hater gets their grubby little hands on it and uses it to mock Clay in some way. That gives them too much power and in the end, unless someone has clack of Clay doing something he shouldn't be doing, there is no clack or anything that the haters can do with any clack that can hurt Clay. JMO and all that.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAndre Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 Claygasm, JMO doesn't vary that much from mine because HELLO, even Clay mocks Clay sometimes. He quite frequently is eminently mockable. Lord knows I mock him. And his fan base. Including myself. Clay gives as good as he gets. I just can't stress for these people. I hope stressing makes them happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcknrllmom Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 I thought his voice sounded much richer in Merrillville....a lot better ...he gets older, his voice gets better..... Some people just like to find fault and complain like its their job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claygasm Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 And now they have decided his weight gain (because, you know, he's soooooooooooo FAT!) is because of the Paxil too. What are these people doing? Researching all the possible side effects of Paxil? With all the gorgeous pictures and clack, don't they have any thing better to do??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcknrllmom Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 Boggles the mind doesnt it?? I thought he looked pretty thin in Merrillville.... I am sure they probably started their research project the minute he said he was taking it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
playbiller Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 I'd like to see video tagged, like photos, so we can identify the woner quicker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JennaZ Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 Oh, I think that individual Clack gatherers should have the right to determine what should or should not be shared publicly. I just believe that it's not too much to ask that they take a moment consider possible consequences. I'm not saying we shouldn't see anything imperfect. Just that we understand that Clack can be used by anyone. If we decide that discretion is unnecessary, and that all Clack is good Clack, we must be willing to accept the misuses with equanimity. Honestly, I don't think the Waukegan clip really impacted Clay much at all. It's such a minor misstep, and it was clearly overshadowed by Jessica Simpson's situation at the Kennedy Center. I'm not sure it needed to be kept offline, really. However, it's not a bad idea to at least think about potential conquences whenever we share Clack, even for a second. 99.9999% of the time, the possibility of a negative outcome is minimal. However, that extra second of thought could be significant in that .0001% of cases when restraint may actually be in Clay's best interest. I suspect there is a fear that a call for discretion would create a chilling effect. I don't think that has to happen. I think we just need to be more more aware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bottlecap Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 So, I probably shouldn't bring up how much Clay's quadruple chin when he's doing the neck tuck face amuses me? I have found the Clack and blog and voice discussions over the last few days to be at times frustrating and at times illuminating. This fandom is seldom dull, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcknrllmom Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 So, I probably shouldn't bring up how much Clay's quadruple chin when he's doing the neck tuck face amuses me? I have found the Clack and blog and voice discussions over the last few days to be at times frustrating and at times illuminating. This fandom is seldom dull, is it? DULL is not a word I would ever use to describe it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claygasm Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 (edited) You know, even at his thinest I have always noticed at least a double chin on Clay! Before we knew he was taking Paxil, people blamed whatever he took for his allergies. I'd like to see video tagged, like photos, so we can identify the woner quicker. I don't even tag my photos. I tried. It was too much work. And I guess I don't really care if everyone knows they are mine or not. Not to mention, tags are easily and often removed. If someone wants to claim a photo of mine as theirs so be it. Not much I can do to stop them. And I don't care if I get the credit for them. Its not like I am making any money off of them. I take them for my pleasure and I like to share - if they're any good. But that's just me. Honestly, I don't think the Waukegan clip really impacted Clay much at all. It's such a minor misstep, and it was clearly overshadowed by Jessica Simpson's situation at the Kennedy Center. I'm not sure it needed to be kept offline, really. Ok. I'll bite. What happened with Jessica Simpson at the Kennedy Center??? Edited December 5, 2006 by Claygasm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muskifest Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 Ah, KAndre, my love...thank you for this...I needed such as I crunch numbers... Clay gives as good as he gets Indeed. I've ALWAYS thought he would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bottlecap Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 Honestly, I don't think the Waukegan clip really impacted Clay much at all. It's such a minor misstep, and it was clearly overshadowed by Jessica Simpson's situation at the Kennedy Center. I'm not sure it needed to be kept offline, really. Ok. I'll bite. What happened with Jessica Simpson at the Kennedy Center??? As the AP reported it: Singer-actress Jessica Simpson was in tears last night after flubbing a song she was performing during the Kennedy Center Honors. Simpson was on stage to sing Nine to Five as part of the tribute to Dolly Parton, one of the evening's five honorees. Simpson ended her performance abrupty with the words "so nervous" and quickly exited the stage. The stunned audience remained silent, giving her no applause. Simpson appeared to be crying when she and other singers in the tribute returned to the stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claygasm Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 Honestly, I don't think the Waukegan clip really impacted Clay much at all. It's such a minor misstep, and it was clearly overshadowed by Jessica Simpson's situation at the Kennedy Center. I'm not sure it needed to be kept offline, really. Ok. I'll bite. What happened with Jessica Simpson at the Kennedy Center??? As the AP reported it: Singer-actress Jessica Simpson was in tears last night after flubbing a song she was performing during the Kennedy Center Honors. Simpson was on stage to sing Nine to Five as part of the tribute to Dolly Parton, one of the evening's five honorees. Simpson ended her performance abrupty with the words "so nervous" and quickly exited the stage. The stunned audience remained silent, giving her no applause. Simpson appeared to be crying when she and other singers in the tribute returned to the stage. Wow. What happened? Maybe she should have borrowed her sister's lip synching tapes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atinal Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 I think I fall somewhere in there where JennaZ is when it comes to posting Clack. I think Clay has been very generous to this fandom in allowing the Clack gathering to go on the past couple of years, and yes I'm sure there has been some benefit to him from the posting of the videos. I think Clay can handle all of the crap that comes his way, God knows he's had to do a lot of it these past few years. That said, I wish his feelings would be considered when deciding what should be posted for the "whole world" to see. I'm sure it was bad enough having an audience of 2000 or more see it live, and I can't help but feel that if he had had a choice he would rather have not had that piece of Clack out in cyber space. This is a case when I don't think it is always about us. No, Clay is not perfect, it wasn't his first live mistake and it won't be his last, I'm sure, and most of them have been captured for all posterity. I don't think using a little discretion is asking too much. Obviously milage varies on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muskifest Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 Thought you guys might get a kick out of this "not just us" story.... (day1clayfan @ Dec 5 2006, 02:28 PM on EAYOR) eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep...back from Verona and although I didn't actually meet him, I did get to shake his hand outside the buses, so all is well!!!! AMAZING performance last night! I was equivalent to about 25 rows back, elevated, not a bad seat in the house, but I'd have liked to be closer, but thats ok! Voice was perfect, banter was hilarious and I LOVE THAT MAN all over again!!!! (hands are soft and warm! third time I've 'touched him' but everytime is like the first ) My friend who was with me, loves his voice, but never really saw my 'attraction', well, she forgot to let go of his hand momentarily, had ahold of one of the rings, haha! and afterwards she said to me..."Vicki, he is BEAUTIFUL!" I'm like "thats what I've been trying to tell you!!!!" This really tickles me...I can just imagine her face as she looked at his while he held her hand....can't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansamcw Posted December 5, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 Wow so many things to discuss... Muskifest...with regards to AIW...I have to agree...I think I will be nervous about this until this tour is over. What makes me nervous is not that he won't sound perfect every night...but that he does not strain his chords too much. Right now he is really concentrating hard not to do this, to use proper technique so he does hit the note and not put undo strain on himself...at this point I think it is going to get better as whatever it was that made him have a hard time Friday night has passed. BUT...it really wouldn't be Clay if he does not try and challenge himself. I remember after IT I was worried that his next tour he wouldn't be able to handle doing the whole 2 hours by himself. Well what did he do for NAT...but have two of his most challenging songs placed towards the end of the concert when he must be pretty tired. THen with JBT...we get solitaire and BOTW plus all those rocking out tunes...again very challenging for him...He just never goes the easy route and that is what makes him so special. Banter...I really don't see how he can do it any other way. I was actually impressed that aside from using the word Clack, he never really uses inside jokes that would alienate non-internet fans. He did explain who Ethel was...he tried to make the newbies interact with the mulitple concert goers and he has learned to choose the people he will give attention to...I do think the Not.Just.Us are enjoying the funny ...and if there are famehoing fans...its us that are following the concert that will just get pissed off cos we would know why they did it. But to the newbies...it will all seem like new. I do worry that the spontaneity will disappear as his audience anticipates his regular jokes...but so far he finds something new to talk about and the best way to do that is to interact with your audience...cos that will always be unpredictable. Clack... JennaZ WORD. I understand what y'all are saying that we shouldn;t worry about keeping Clay all perfect and such. I agree...thats why I am not too bothered by the fact that the botched note video is out there. I don't think it really hurts him. BUT...at this point we have to be aware that the haters are very relentless in their desire to hurt Clay. With You Tube out there...they can distrubute any clack pretty fast. So I do think that when sharing clack people should always keep in mind that this is a big possibility and do what they are comfortable doing with the clack they have. It would really have to be in the discretion of the videographers cos I am also uncomfortable with imposing guidelines. The tagging of videos is just for the protection of the video creator. Apprently if your video is being used inappropriately there is some need to prove that the video is yours. Properly tagging them makes it easier to stop other people from using your videos in ways you didn't intend. Paxil...eh...don;t really know enough about its side effects...I do think he added weight but just enough to not make him look emaciated. It could be due to having a cook prepare his meals...who knows? I don't think it really matters. EEEEEEEEEEEEEEE for Play who will be seeing tonights concert...hope all goes well for you. Looking forward to your report. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansamcw Posted December 5, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 Ok listening to the verona clack...I wish there was more but his voice is just excellent. Very stroen and I think he is fully in control once again. Just beautiful tones coming out of this guy... whoever says his voice is shot is seriously not listening with great speakers or head phones. eta: oh no muski...it wasn't you that said that...I have heard it elsewhere. oh and this is comment on MDYK, HYMALC, OCOCE...these are the only clack that Ive seen so far...yeah he was yelling a bit in AIW...I still think he needs to put a lot of energy to that cos its just a tough section to sing..so in essence she starts yelling..in tune..heh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muskifest Posted December 6, 2006 Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 Well, I haven't said his voice is shot, fur shure (that concept blows me away and the idea that someone actually thinks he's losing it is beyond any brain cell's imagining )...but I did think he seemed to be yelling some when I and watched and listened to AIW one time on my computer last night. When I get home, I'll put on my groovy noise-canceling headphones and give it a listen without looking at him singing. Although....not looking at him.... gee...I don't know about that.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansamcw Posted December 6, 2006 Author Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 speaking of profiles.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeidiHo Posted December 6, 2006 Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 Excuse me, some of us low forehead people are not exactly dummies....are we? Um. No. Of course not. <g> AIW?? I think I would prefer that he stop singing it every night simply because it sounds hard on his voice and he has too many concerts in a row without a break. And for a lot of the reasons Muski said. <g> I had no problem with Ethel's "It's all good" the other night in Merrillville, because it seemed to me to be perfectly in keeping with the moment, and my take is that Clay appreciated it. Having read the post by the woman who was trying, as far as I can tell, to discretely tell Clay he might be going to have a wardrobe malfunction last night, I don't have a problem with that either. The drunken-sounding shouting I heard on the cell-stream last night? Not so much. Planning things to try to get Clay's attention? Just say "NO." No forcing of the moment, no annoying fame-whoring "Pick Me!" "Notice Me!" behaviour, which is where I can see the whole schtick going. I trust Clay to be funny and quick, I just don't trust some fans to rein it in when appropriate. YMMV, of course, and my opinions are all Clack-based since I won't be going to a concert myself. I like Ethel. I’ve spoken with her and she seems like a very nice person who loves Clay. I think a lot of the Ethel detractors are more than a tad jealous. I am, and I’m not afraid to admit it. <g> I agree with the rest of your post – I think there are quite a few people who do things to deliberately get attention and some of them pick on Ethel. <g> I think when it gets too much Clay will change it up – hadn’t he done that before? Just when fans make a plan to get his attention he changes his schtick. Smart man, that Clay. <g> I can see all sides to the Clack issue, frankly. I guess what it comes down to is I think people should engage their brains (especially after this) and *think* about all the possible uses for any clack that is less than flattering to *Clay*. If they decide to upload it anyway? Fine and dandy. It’s *their* decision how to handle *their* Clack – but don’t bitch when it’s used against Clay. There is no excuse, at this point. I think it bothers me that no one seems to consider the subject’s potential feelings on the subject. Of course, if it gets too bad he can always outlaw clack gathering like any other artist out there. Or what JennaZ said. <g> And now they have decided his weight gain (because, you know, he's soooooooooooo FAT!) is because of the Paxil too. What are these people doing? Researching all the possible side effects of Paxil? With all the gorgeous pictures and clack, don't they have any thing better to do??? Oh yeah, Clay’s just a big ole fatty. :::rolls eyes::: Any weight gain is just as easily explained by the aging process. When Clay tied the two together in his banter, he wasn’t far off. <g> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muskifest Posted December 6, 2006 Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 Hello, Heidi Ho! I don't know you, but I've seen you around...hee... CMSU when I read about people saying Clay is fat. Clay is lazy. That's all. He does nothing to tone up what flesh he has...so when he gains any at all, it is noticeable...imo, of course. There's heredity involved too---in such things as his double chin, etc. He doesn't have that Brad Pitt jaw line so when he makes all his faces, everything moves around! I have to admit I've sometimes gotten rather warm imagining what Clay's body would look like if he toned up some. Not talking about getting all fireplug neck on us, but just....harden up certain parts, you know? yeah...I know... And before anybody says anything, Yeah...I'm just fine with him the way he is, too. Soft, hard...whatever... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claygasm Posted December 6, 2006 Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 I showed my father my montage today. He liked it and then I said "You have to admit Clay has a great voice". He didn't say anything. I said "Come on! He has a great voice!" He looked at me and said "I don't like that wavering thing he does." Wavering thing? On MGUCL?? Leave it to my father to find something negative to say about something or someone I like. :glare: Speaking of my montage, You Tube is a far reaching thing. I got a message from someone in Slovakia! She had seen my montage and loved it. She said she was a big Clay fan but could never find anything of his. I asked her how she came to know about Clay. Apparently they showed AI3 there and when he came back to sing "Solitaire" she fell in love. Since then she spends a lot of time on the internet searching for clack. I sent her YSI's of the EP. I figure since it was a Walmart exclusive she wouldn't be finding it in Slovakia. *g* She emailed me back after she had listened to all 4 songs and was sooooooooo happy! She said AIW made her cry and she promised to spread the clack among all her friends! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ldyjocelyn Posted December 6, 2006 Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 I'm positive everyone is in the concert thread...so I'm gonna write instead.... I had no problem with Ethel's "It's all good" the other night in Merrillville, because it seemed to me to be perfectly in keeping with the moment, and my take is that Clay appreciated it. Having read the post by the woman who was trying, as far as I can tell, to discretely tell Clay he might be going to have a wardrobe malfunction last night, I don't have a problem with that either. The drunken-sounding shouting I heard on the cell-stream last night? Not so much. Planning things to try to get Clay's attention? Just say "NO." No forcing of the moment, no annoying fame-whoring "Pick Me!" "Notice Me!" behaviour, which is where I can see the whole schtick going. I trust Clay to be funny and quick, I just don't trust some fans to rein it in when appropriate. YMMV, of course, and my opinions are all Clack-based since I won't be going to a concert myself. You are me. While I've never been lucky enough to meet Ethel, she strikes me as a kind hearted woman who has a huge personality and who simply loves Clay Aiken. What got me about her "it's all good" the other night was that it was really saying -- "hey Clay, if you mess this mess up again this evening, I'll still love you." That's the way it came off for me, anyway. Unconditional. As far as the rest of the banter goes...yes, I'm not worried about what Clay will do. He seems to handle almost any situation he gets thrown in these segments, and if gets really bad, teacher Clay comes out. (Have I mentioned that I find Teacher Clay hawt?) But it is the fans that make me nervous. Attention hounds that tend to showboat are probably plotting and planning on how to get Clay's eye during the banter as I write, and that makes me sad. AIW?? I think I would prefer that he stop singing it every night simply because it sounds hard on his voice and he has too many concerts in a row without a break. And for a lot of the reasons Muski said. <g> I can see that. I just don't think that Clay's the kind that will do that, especially for the encore. I think he'll get rid of a song or two early in the show to keep the power for the end. He's a showboater that way, IMO. I can see all sides to the Clack issue, frankly. I guess what it comes down to is I think people should engage their brains (especially after this) and *think* about all the possible uses for any clack that is less than flattering to *Clay*. If they decide to upload it anyway? Fine and dandy. It’s *their* decision how to handle *their* Clack – but don’t bitch when it’s used against Clay. There is no excuse, at this point. I think it bothers me that no one seems to consider the subject’s potential feelings on the subject. Of course, if it gets too bad he can always outlaw clack gathering like any other artist out there. Or what JennaZ said. <g> I think, for me, the discussion was getting a bit mixed up in my brain for a while. As far as putting the clack out there...IMO it really is up to the clack procurer, and as Heidi says, they should realize there are consequences. But, for a while today, as I was thinking about this, I was a bit concerned about how I feel as a WATCHER of certain pieces of clack. I finally had to separate myself from that feeling...that I shouldn't feel guilty for watching things and making my own decisions. Does that make any sense. And now they have decided his weight gain (because, you know, he's soooooooooooo FAT!) is because of the Paxil too. What are these people doing? Researching all the possible side effects of Paxil? With all the gorgeous pictures and clack, don't they have any thing better to do??? Oh yeah, Clay’s just a big ole fatty. :::rolls eyes::: Any weight gain is just as easily explained by the aging process. When Clay tied the two together in his banter, he wasn’t far off. <g> Heh. Fat and old, that's Clay. Of course, I will always love him. Besides, luckiest1 and I were noticing the other night...the man has the skinniest legs. If he puts on weight, it needs to be there. Might make those big old boats at the bottom of his legs not look so gigantic. *g* I updated my poor neglected blog this evening. There was something that happened this weekend that just had to come out. Yes, it's schmoopie. Shut up. I can have lust for the man and still write schmoopie too. The Cat Librarian Claygasm, cool story about the international fan! But a pox on your father.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claygasm Posted December 6, 2006 Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 (edited) Oh dear. Did you know the whole purpose the the Walmart/RCA exclusive EP was a bait and switch masterminded by RCA to sell more of Chris' album??? Edited December 6, 2006 by Claygasm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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