#22: Which brings us to Clay Aiken, as most good conversations should

[muskifest]

Crap! So sorry for those of you not able to make a concert because of stupid snow! That kind of thing HAS to be in Webster's within the definition of "DISAPPOINTMENT"...

And keepingfaith, I wasn't trying to be secretive...heh...I just had been watching various videos so have no idea which venue delivered one particularly satisfying hands and fingers debacle. I wish I had the time to research this for you, however... :F_05BL17blowkiss:

And a big :bday: to wandacleo and keldanker!

I can't WAIT to see THE definitive BEST OF CITH after this is all over, you know? I wanted to put together an audio best of (so far) for a local Clay-loving friend, but it's such a daunting task---a wonderful one, mind you---but one that takes time...Then I saw that mimefan had created wav files of the whole DC concert in individual files so I did that one....Eventually, I want to be able to give this friend the 'best of' DCAT and CITH....

Shetland Pony? :th74: Sure...I'd take it for a ride...

[ldyjocelyn]

So now Shetland ponies are taking steroids? Why isn't this on CNN? Or Fox Noise at least?

Seriously....I love those bangs. Seriously. Very seriously.

And I've never wanted a pony so much as a I do right now.

merrieeee, I TOTALLY understand your feelings regarding the power trip that can be felt when "I know something you don't know," and I agree that the headiness of that is probably what led to so much of the entire thing.

Scarlett, I loved reading the "conversation." BWAH!

jamar, congratulations on your team winning! YAY! :3:

luckiest1, cindilu2 and gang -- big :F_05BL17blowkiss: and to you all. Been there, done that....still haven't quite gotten over it yet, even though a year has gone by. But yeah, there's safety to consider before all else. It doesn't make it feel any better though.

Man, I hope Clay and company make it to the show safely.

:bday2: wandacleo and keldanker!

[ldyjocelyn]

Ride'm pony!!!

[Couch Tomato]

Ok I bring minor, very minor information (cuz of course my sources are of the low level variety)... but apparantly Sasha was in San Francisco yesterday performing at an ice show and of course she skated to CLAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY. That's all. My spies were just family of a lurker so didn't get important information like which song. hee. I'm sure it's the same one from Xmas show. But they sure knew Clay's voice right away. He's so special.

he LdyJ..ride'em pony indeed

[wandacleo]

I would build a fucking Great Wall of China between myself and fans .

I think he HAS! I remember reading that he had a strict no-fraternization clause in the contracts of those working for him--and I'm sure he is the strictest adherent. In today's world, he would be NUTS to go near the fans. Sorry, but that's just true. Look how many people have come crawling out of the woodwork to say that they were duped (by a Clay who had to be a duplicitous liar). Idiots.

That's not the Clay I know (and I'm not saying one goddamn word about OUR secret phone calls).

[JennaZ]

Another Morristown M&G report at CB from LynninNJ is here:

Morristown M&G

She basically confirms Emerson's report. Excerpt:

It was then that he looked at me and said (i'm paraphrasing here), "well, there are some rumors out there.....that I have fathered a child......AND THEN LOOKING RIGHT AT _______ SAID, "and i believe you're the one who has started them!"

Well, the room fell silent.......and that is where it all gets really blurry.......cause all of our heads were spinning. What I can tell you is that Clay DID have papers in front of him that he was reading from......but I can't say where they were from or anything........he was giving examples of her stories and she was shaking her head, and starting to cry. YOU SEE......SHE DENIED THE WHOLE THING. From the moment that Clay pointed his finger at her (after my innocent question that i never DID get my answer to!) she denied EVER having said that Clay was the father of her babies......and that she was being scammed by people that were posting as her, etc........she certainly had her story planned. I couldn't believe that the whole thing was actually happening, but worse yet.....i couldn't believe she was DENYING it. He continued to read more and ask her some questions....and then as she got visibly more upset - he backed down from the reading and questions.

[keepingfaith]

And fake Clay was indeed bemoaning how he hates RCA and wants to go elsewhere but they won't let him loose and he was so depressed about it. Well I can certainly see then why even a slightly different opinion was not acceptable to say. Ya'll know Ansa..she's not extreme yet she was basically told to shut up as she was hurting Clay for offering alternate views.

I had a similar experience, and I'm still a little miffed about the whole thing. But I don't have a lot of sympathy, maybe none, for the dupes. These people believed crap that flied in the face of common sense. I knew something was behind it, just had no idea what. Now it looks like the heart of darkness was behind it. If those people hadn't run like a pack of dogs to tear into any and all who thought it was questionable, not to mention STUPID, for Clay's fans to attack his record label -- then maybe I'd have a softer heart about this. But how this played out is inexcusable to me.

I have to give a shout out to lightmyfire. Honey, you fought the fight against this madness for so long, and with so much being thrown against you because of it. If only people had listened to reason many moons ago ...

I used to tell my mother, an avid watcher of soaps, that the only reason these soap characters had so much drama in their lives was because everybody kept secrets from everyone else. If they all got in a room together and spilled their guts ... no more show. I think the quickest way to destroy any group or family is through secrets ... and this business caused a serious breach. I almost left the online fandom within weeks of joining last year, and I'm sure many, many actually did leave. I know that I met scores of fans during the summer tour who told me they aren't on the boards anymore because of the inside information and condescending attitudes. I think that keeping big important secrets is always an abomination, and a source of great misery.

Bottom line for me is when inside information doesn't pass the smell test, and the common sense test, or any test I can think of, and yet it abides, and is protected, fostered and spread intentionally, and the questioners of it are pounced on and ridiculed with immunity ... I doubt I could ever trust anyone I know to be involved with it. Oh, some will be running for the hills and disavowing any knowledge just as surely as Mr. Phelps did in Mission Impossible ... but I'll not forget.

Oh and it is going to be 56 here today and sunny.

At least it was chilly enough this morning to burn a log in the fireplace. It's already warming up, but the fire was nice for a change.

And keepingfaith, I wasn't trying to be secretive...heh...I just had been watching various videos so have no idea which venue delivered one particularly satisfying hands and fingers debacle. I wish I had the time to research this for you, however... :F_05BL17blowkiss:

Not to worry. According to Scarlett, Clay was busy with the fingers last night, and everybody got it! (Yeah, she said it, take it from there ...)

[jmh123]

Right now I can pretend he's the little Shetland pony I wanted to play with as a child. hee.

BWAH!!!

Scarlett, you didn't tell us what the big bristly is for! Do we break it up and burn it, or what?

Oh, you have such a dirty mind! It was too big and too bristly. And there was a scrapey thing on the other end too. Apparently it's something that's in common use here, a snow brush. I'm keeping it because people assured me I'll need it today.

MUAH to Scarlett and all the brave souls in the tundra today, be they residents or people who came from far away for concerts. All of you be careful!!

Car brushes and snow shovels are What I Miss Least About the North. Imagine being shorter than most adults on the planet and old to boot, and dealing with that mess all winter! I remember trying to explain to my mother why I had to clean the snow off my car. She thought it would just melt away when the sun came out, right? HAHA. Of course the first winter I was in PA, there was a 22 inch snowfall in Raleigh.

OK rhia might be a little off the chart - but does anyone know what snow, and freezing cold wether does to black hair. I simply don't have time to sit still for 6 hours today to get my hair braided and I'm wondering if I should go with normal nappy or try to get a perm.

Just remember you're going to have hat head anyway, so there is no hope for your hair unless you are willing to freeze for beauty. I vote for normal nappy.

Even though info is king in the fandom I do think having that connection to Clay is probably what drove all this. Apprantly this has been going on for 4 years and for ClayNation i think it was held pretty close to the vest. And fake Clay was indeed bemoaning how he hates RCA and wants to go elsewhere but they won't let him loose and he was so depressed about it. Well I can certainly see then why even a slightly different opinion was not acceptable to say. Ya'll know Ansa..she's not extreme yet she was basically told to shut up as she was hurting Clay for offering alternate views. It's all just very odd. I would just never believe that Clay was emailing and texting and pming me. I'd go..ok if this is you..you need to add the word garana to your concert banter tomorrow heh. But I'd just have a hard time getting past the portrayal - it goes against everything I know of the man and that would be hypocritical territory for me and I'd have been long gone. And in all this time did not any supposed PM or communication conflict with Clay's schedule. We learn quite a few things after the fact when it comes to some things.

[wandacleo]

Just a little birthday note to document my oncoming senility. I knew I was having a birthday but completely FORGOT that I would be a year older until my friend (heartless bitch) reminded me.

[lilyshine]

Thanks couchie, but we've decided not to chance it. The roads are just terrible and the snow is falling at an alarming rate right now. We still have hopes of Merrillville next weekend though.

Very smart move. Buffalo in early winter really gets dumped on with the lake effect snow. I'm 3hrs. east of Buffalo and it's a mess here. It was sleeting early and glazed the roads, now it's snowing to add a layer of slush. I think I'll light a fire & enjoy! I'm sad I missed W'port, but very happy not to have had to have driven home today.

Couchie said:

It's all just very odd. I would just never believe that Clay was emailing and texting and pming me. I'd go..ok if this is you..you need to add the word garana to your concert banter tomorrow heh.

I hope there's no secret message here. My screen name on other boards is Granan!!!!!!!!!! Oh wait! A conn.ec.tion.

[jmh123]

HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO WANDACLEO and KELDANKER!!!!

:00003653: :04: :00003653:

I'm going to steal this one cause it's purdy. The happiest of birthdays to you both, and so sorry about that additional year, wandacleo.

Thanks couchie, but we've decided not to chance it. The roads are just terrible and the snow is falling at an alarming rate right now. We still have hopes of Merrillville next weekend though.

AWWWWWWWW - so, so sorry.

[cindilu2]

That's what I don't understand the most... how could anybody have believed this 'Clay' was for real? It just doesn't compute. I'm not saying people can't be duplicitous, that people don't and can't have secrets. But come on. As scrutinized as Clay has been these past four years? My head is sore from shaking it, and I am in an incredibly bad mood - so I'll just stop typing now.

If anybody is going to Erie and is sitting far back - there's a sixth row seat that'll be empty for moving up.

[Couch Tomato]

That's what I don't understand the most... how could anybody have believed this 'Clay' was for real? It just doesn't compute. I'm not saying people can't be duplicitous, that people don't and can't have secrets. But come on. As scrutinized as Clay has been these past four years? My head is sore from shaking it, and I am in an incredibly bad mood - so I'll just stop typing now.

That's where I'm at too. Yeah it's easy to sit here and say what I would have done but really this characterization is just so off the chain that it just flies in the face of everything I know about Clay. I mean he sounds really weak and pathetic and assholy. Flaws are one thing but this? Nope.

Jenna thanks for bringing that link. I've purposely kept from delving way deep but am interested in the outline so to speak.

[JennaZ]

Ya'll know Ansa..she's not extreme yet she was basically told to shut up as she was hurting Clay for offering alternate views. It's all just very odd. I would just never believe that Clay was emailing and texting and pming me. I'd go..ok if this is you..you need to add the word garana to your concert banter tomorrow heh. But I'd just have a hard time getting past the portrayal - it goes against everything I know of the man and that would be hypocritical territory for me and I'd have been long gone. And in all this time did not any supposed PM or communication conflict with Clay's schedule. We learn quite a few things after the fact when it comes to some things.

This FC information certainly helps explain the vehemence of the "anti-RCA" position, although IMHO, it doesn't quite justify the condescension and bullying that went along with it. Many who pleaded for reason were treated, not merely as idiots, but as traitors. Hard feelings may still linger. I kind of wish that those who now recognize the falsity of the information would apologize for their actions of the past year...but I'm not holding my breath.

I'm with you, Couchie. There have been "fake Clay's" and fake Clay "insiders" since the start of the fandom. Though some may flatter themselves into believing that their status and "expertise" are significant enough to warrant his personal attention and appreciation, I tend to believe that his contact with fans should be and has been primarily through official channels like the OFC. And he has plenty of friends and professional advisers at his disposal. I just can't see why one would believe he'd discuss serious personal and career issues with fans, no matter how smart they may think they are. He's shown to have much more common sense than that.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO WANDACLEO and KELDANKER

[muskifest]

This FC information certainly helps explain the vehemence of the "anti-RCA" position, although IMHO, it doesn't quite justify the condescension and bullying that went along with it. Many who pleaded for reason were treated, not merely as idiots, but as traitors. Hard feelings may still linger. I kind of wish that those who now recognize the falsity of the information would apologize for their actions of the past year...but I'm not holding my breath.

My bolding, but word, Jenna. I keep thinking about the blogs Clay's made that TRIED to set various things straight, and I remember how I wondered then if ANY of people would recognize themselves when reading his words. The answer is

NO.

He's a better human than I am. I'm totally in awe of him--that he could hug and forgive the woman as he did. I also respect him even more when I read that he told her he wasn't likely to believe her. Honest and forgiving.

Whatamanwhatamanwhataveryfineman.

[playbiller]

Happy birthday Wandacleo and Keldanker

OK, now everyone is congradulating themselves on not believing in fake Clay on all the boards byt they are still buying into the RCA crap from fake Clay and not believing the real Clay about staying with them as long as they will have them? OK, I can see where some people need to buy into a needy Clay. It does explain a lot.

Safe travels to those travleing and sympathy to those not going.

[ldyjocelyn]

This FC information certainly helps explain the vehemence of the "anti-RCA" position, although IMHO, it doesn't quite justify the condescension and bullying that went along with it. Many who pleaded for reason were treated, not merely as idiots, but as traitors. Hard feelings may still linger. I kind of wish that those who now recognize the falsity of the information would apologize for their actions of the past year...but I'm not holding my breath.

My bolding, but word, Jenna. I keep thinking about the blogs Clay's made that TRIED to set various things straight, and I remember how I wondered then if ANY of people would recognize themselves when reading his words. The answer is

NO.

He's a better human than I am. I'm totally in awe of him--that he could hug and forgive the woman as he did. I also respect him even more when I read that he told her he wasn't likely to believe her. Honest and forgiving.

Whatamanwhatamanwhataveryfineman.

What these ladies said. Every single word of it.

I love you guys.

[jumpingjacks]

Y'all will love this. Two of the biggies in this mess who tried to get me involved are now telling the admins that I am the liar. That I was the one who "doctored" the crazy ones PMs to me. WTF? Can you believe this shit?

[aikim]

Big hugs to all of you that are missing concerts this week due to weather...hoping to see some of you in Merrillville...it is actually supposed to warm up here this week and possible rain midweek which should melt some of the snow...keeping fingers crossed that we have fine weather next week-end.

Honestly, I don't know what to believe anymore and I am still taking anything that comes out of a M &G, especially anything from Morristown with a grain of salt.

Kim

[jmh123]

Y'all will love this. Two of the biggies in this mess who tried to get me involved are now telling the admins that I am the liar. That I was the one who "doctored" the crazy ones PMs to me. WTF? Can you believe this shit?

Good lord! Unfortunately, the jig is up for them. Vindication isn't as sweet as people think it is, because the damage is already done, but at least you know, and some of us know.

[jumpingjacks]

Y'all will love this. Two of the biggies in this mess who tried to get me involved are now telling the admins that I am the liar. That I was the one who "doctored" the crazy ones PMs to me. WTF? Can you believe this shit?

Good lord! Unfortunately, the jig is up for them. Vindication isn't as sweet as people think it is, because the damage is already done, but at least you know, as some of us know.

I told the admin who was questioning me that I have no reason to lie about who was involved. Why in the world would I create a lie with those two people? I've only met one of them and that was once....at the first CD release party. Sheesh.

I think the admin finally realizes that they have much more to lie about than I...I'm a nobody in this fandom, quite frankly.

[Cotton]

Unfortunately, this girl is just the tip of the iceberg, I think. I think there are YOOGE games being played and she is just one of many players. It's sick. It really is.

Word, JJ. Too much backchannel stuff is not good. I wish everyone could be considered equal and have the same info. I think things would have never gotten this bad if people had come forward.

Hi, All!

Lots to absorb in the last few days.

I really hate the 'NAME NO NAMES' policy. I understand, to a degree, because who is to say which names to name as some innocents may end up being misidentified. Name-calling will cause that. But I know - as in have met and talked and emailed with (limited, though) - one who has been identified as a duped one at at least one site. I thought she had credibility initially. But that contact was in and around the Kimmel ATDW promo and no contact since then. All I heard from her was anti-RCA stuff. Never heard any FC or GF stuff.

But I wish we knew the key players. Some have apparently been given admin protection. That bothers me.

OTOH, I have never believed Clay as weak, frightened, haunted, secretive - and certainly NEVER sleezy!!!

That's what I find so hard to believe - people so ready to see Clay Aiken as that guy!

Color me puzzled.

FEAR and PLAY! Wish there had been a certain story read in M'Town, but I truly never thought it would be.

Woulda been fun, though!

SAFE TRAVELS to all the snow-trekkers!

Big Hugs :F_05BL17blowkiss: to all who have had to forego their taste of CITH!!!

ETA:

Permaswooned! How are you, Honey?

[PermaSwooned]

So here I sit, waiting impatiently to be discharged from the hospital, and finally able to catch up on the boards. I couldn't have a laptop in the Cardiac Care Unit, so my son brought it to me after I got transferred yesterday, and now it's time to go home anyway.

So I gather it's been an interesting few days???? Good thing I didn't know about it or my heart problems might have been a lot worse!!!

I find Clay Aiken to be a fascinating individual, so every new little piece of the puzzle is like a fun little gift. That being said, I've always been unhappy that his most intimate personal life has been the source of so much speculation. Really, it's SO not my business. My life is too hectic already (hence my stay here in the hospital) without worrying about dreadful "insider" information that all sounds like bad fan-fic.

Thankfully, I was not deemed to have good "insider" potential, evidently, so was able to bump along in my happy place meeting wonderful people and making lasting friendships and supporting and enjoying a great guy with a wonderful voice. I'm counting my blessings here!

After moaning for weeks that I would not be able to go to Minneapolis because it meant 4 MORE days away from work and the airfares were too high and I was pooped from all my November travel, the fares dropped last Tuesday. Plus, I saw a way to fly out late on Tues. and fly home early on Friday and only miss 2 days of work. So, I bought my plane ticket and reserved my hotel room. Dang.

I was looking for a sign as to whether or not I should go. I was not looking to collapse at work with my heart trying to keep in rhythm with the Jazzy Medley. I would have liked to have avoided that altogether, but having it happen BEFORE I bought that plane ticket would have been second best. Oh well.

In view of current events, I want to give special smoochie thanks to a very special FCAer, my cyber-friend Solo. I have generally been pretty lucky with taking photos at Clay concerts. Not this tour. As far as I know, there have only been 3 venues that shut down photography....Waukegan, D.C., and Wilkes-Barre. It looks like I'll only make 3 concerts.....Waukegan, D.C. and Kalamazoo. As luck would have it, our ticket group in Kalamazoo got upgraded to 1st row Pit right before the concert. Good news....at least until I saw that my view of Clay was COMPLETELY obstructed by the 1st chair cellist. jojoct was next to me, and she leaned WAAAAAAYYY in to dc4clay and I draped myself over her to be able to get a partial view, but it was just.not.good. I was whining about it at intermission, and Solo, who was sitting 4 seats from me, offered to trade seats with me so I could take photos. She said she had 5 more concerts, including front row center in Minneapolis, so she didn't mind. Can you believe that? I can still hardly believe it now!!! So I shot a billion pictures that second half, that I hope to be able to share soon. I hoped to be able to get more in Minneapolis, but it just isn't meant to be.

I was SO looking forward to meeting up with FCAers in the frozen North. I planned to send out lots of PMs this weekend and make plans. I hope y'all have a fabulous time. I know Clay will be at his amazing-est, especially since he said Minnesota was one of his favorite places to tour. Downtown Minneapolis is really gorgeous at Christmas, and they know how to do "flurries" there, so I know you will all be fine. Wish I could be there with you.

[cindilu2]

I don't even like reading those words here.

[atinal]

I must be dumber than a stump, In reading the M&G report that Jenna linked there's reference to this girl's (babymama's) friends being so excited for her getting to meet Clay. So, supposedly they believe that he is the father of her babies, but their all excited that she's getting a meet & greet?!?! It defies logic to me, I mean wouldn't she have already met him?

I used to be so impressed by the level of intelligence and knowledge that was evident in this fandom, but just prior to the ATDW release and after, it did almost seem like a sequel to "Invasion of the Body Snatchers" There were posters who I had always thought brought reason and intelligence to discussions that were posting some mind boggling scenarios and it just never made sense to me. I came to understand the "fan of fans" because a lot of people were falling in line lock step with their theories and opinions.

Yesterday, I read the article that CHA CHA, linked, that showed me how seriously scary this can be, and it looks like this whole thing could have been just as convoluded as that. I'm a fan of Clay Aiken, I want to enjoy his music, I want to have fun with other fans, I want to look at pretty pictures, It ain't rocket science!,

Cindilu and Luckiest, I'm so sorry about this sucky weather messing up your plans.

Permaswooned, you take care of yourself, we need you up and at 'em when it's time for the next great round of Clay pix.