#29: EEEEEEEEEEEE!!! It's really happening!

[Claygasm]

I really do think the majority of the fandom has let it go already. AI Rewind is bringing it all back and that is why it is being discussed. The passion that we had about this at the end of AI2 was out of this world. I don't believe most people are still passionate about this.

You wouldn't know it by the discussion here today!

[Thankful4Clay]

I really do think the majority of the fandom has let it go already. AI Rewind is bringing it all back and that is why it is being discussed. The passion that we had about this at the end of AI2 was out of this world. I don't believe most people are still passionate about this.

You wouldn't know it by the discussion here today!

Maybe because I went through it, I only see it as discussion of past history.

I do think Clay was royally screwed and I think he would have won if the phones could have handled the votes. That's why I was so passionate and why I supported him in every way that I could.

He has a very successful career and what he went through made him who he is today, so I think it's all good. I don't feel like he 'needs' me the way I thought he did back in 2003.

[Couch Tomato]

I really do think the majority of the fandom has let it go already. AI Rewind is bringing it all back and that is why it is being discussed. The passion that we had about this at the end of AI2 was out of this world. I don't believe most people are still passionate about this.

You wouldn't know it by the discussion here today!

but it's a discussion...I don't think anyone has been over emotional at all... there's a difference I do believe.

[ldyjocelyn]

I do think there is still some emotion involved with AI and Clay for many of the fans. Now, I wasn't part of the online fandom during the show either, but I remember reading some posts later that were just OTT passionate/outraged. When I compare THAT to what I've seen today....IMO, there's such a difference.

Now, I still do believe there is some bitterness -- and I think that some fans hold on to it as if it is a security blanket. But not ALL of them have done that. I think the passage of time has eased the pain a bit for more than a few.

One more thing....the easiest way I've found to come to terms with Clay and AI is to realize that if any of those possibilites for conspiracy/manipulation, etc had NOT happened....I know my fandom would probably be WAY different. Very likely Clay would have won -- and who knows where this would have taken him. It could have been better, but it could have also been way worse. (See: Taylor Hicks)

[Ansamcw]

CG...we can only make conclusions based on our experiences at the time. You say from your experience you were able to vote and some of your Ruben fans were not able to vote...fine. BUT my experience and my conclusions are based on reports of people from all over the country on all the different Clay fan sites and also from what we can read from the Ruben sites. At that time this was very very robust internet fandom...that was actually bigger than it is today IMO...and people were not only reporting their personal experience but that of their friends. From all that report I can only conclude that the inadequate phone lines did hurt Clay. The fact is I am not even bitter about the results. I knew it was going to happen and even before the finals I always had a feeling Clay would do better than coming in second. I don't really believe AI is evil and I do not really believe a lot of the conspiracy theories. But that still does not change my experience at the time...and what I observed.

Now I love the song Vincent. I know that song by heart. Despite the missed words...I still love Clay's version and prefer it to Grobans which I found over produced. But I still think this song was inappropriate for the show....IT IS a dreary song about Van Gogh's suicide...and it is a long song that tells a story...that kind of songs do not translate well in a competition where you will only sing a small part of the song. That's what makes it a stupid song choice and why a lot of people felt it was giving Clay an unfair choice. Then as others have said...changing the song at the time they did and giving him no chance to rehearse...then having Paula go on ET and just keep repeating how clay messed up never mentioning the TWO standing O she gave him...well that is certainly skewing the perception of the public. The thing is that was not the only time the inequity in the PR of Ruben can be seen. What about all those sticks they gave out to people in the audience that only has Ruben's name...was that fair?

The thing is its really funny because if you only rely on the media account during that time...people would think that Clay and Ruben were equally popular or that Ruben is the front runner. The reality is...Clay was way ahead in popularity on line....Clay had tons more mail than everyone combined. Clay had more signs on the show and got louder cheers than anyone on the show. For the media...Ruben was the front runner because that is what the show feeds them. But when you have all the data and info that the on line fans had at the time...Clay was the front runner all through out the show, ever since wildcard and that fact was verified by Nigel.

In a way I understand the bitterness. This fandom worked HARD during those finals...as I said some people bought phones so they can text...the two hour pledges was all over the place and some people from canada even crossed the border to vote. I think the reason why I was able to let it go was that I never really voted. Just followed the whole saga religiously. But for those that spent three hours trying to get one vote in...losing was tough.

[Gibby]

Just testing out my new avie.

[jmh123]

Oooooo nice, Gibby.

too.

[ldyjocelyn]

Gibby, as far as I'm concerned....I hope you post often, 'cause I love your new avi. That smiling guy is soooooooo CUTE!

[keepingfaith]

I watched Rewind all over again tonight and a couple of things jumped out at me ...

The "Vincent" thing probably would have been unnoticed if the judges hadn't mentioned it. Clay did his usual beautiful job of making it his own and his voice was superb. I noticed for the first time that at the end when the camera panned to Clay's friends and family section, Jamie was there. And then I saw her again briefly during a family shot at the end of UM. So that got me thinking, do you guys know who were the girls that were disseminating messages from Clay online, because if he got the word out that night, and Jamie was in the audience that night ... is that a connection?

And I picked up that Kimberley Locke was the conspiratorial one ... she said that she hated "Anyone Who Had A Heart" and she thought Randy gave her that terrible song on purpose. Honestly, it wasn't a terrible song when Dionne Warwicke sang it, but K-Lo didn't do a thing for it. And dressed like she was going to walk her dog in the park didn't help the atmospheres of the performance at all.

Ruben, I liked during SSD, but then I've always loved that song. "Smile" sucked to me, and "If Ever I'm In Your Heart Again" sounded like Ruben's voice was hanging by a frazzled thread. The strain was obvious.

Clay, regardless of the "Vincident" was pure and clear and deep and strong and brilliant on all three songs -- and I adore his performance of MTK because of (1) the last note that still makes me want to stand up and cheer, because he had the most polished and perfect vibrato that was even possible (I also love the authentic way he sang "Mack-ie"; and (2) that Clay went against type to prove that he could sing Vegas staples -- the Sinatra, Dean Martin, Bobby Darin stuff -- and pull it off with the inimitable Clay Aiken touch. His breath control was fabulous. The UM performance was great for me. The high note was thrilling and the way he was pouring out his heart and soul into that song was unsurpassed at that time ... until the next week when he bested himself with BOTW and TITN.

I have to say this, Clay did some songs that I always felt were too short. "Vincent" was extremely short, even with the last-minute extension, so I can see why that happened. Kim and Ruben's first two songs were definitely longer than Clay's songs. I can't imagine there would have been even a skeleton of "Vincent" at the length he sang in rehearsals. MTK was very short, too, but it flowed well and worked because of that huge finish. For the record, I also thought Solitaire was too short. It ended so abruptly that I was kind of shocked when it was over.

Nope, for me the Final 3 belonged to Clay all the way. And according to Nigel's comment a couple of years ago, Clay led the voting that night too.

[Claygasm]

My new motto.....

I WILL NEVER AGAIN EXPRESS MY OPINION ABOUT ANYTHING TO DO WITH AI2.

I can't take the beating!

I will, however, continue to say that the dude that came in second that year is incredibly CUTE!!!

[jmh123]

I have a job interview tomorrow, all day. I just found out Thursday. ACK! But I did it, I'm ready, I'm incredibly prepared, and, I'm scared shitless. It's a great job, the best of any I've applied for in the last two years, and only the seond time out of dozens of applications that I've made it to the interview stage. It's one of my "dream jobs" since I moved here, but there hasn't been an opening til now. It really is a job ideally suited for me, and hopefully, I for them. But the competition is bound to be competitive, LOL. So please, send good vibes. Please!! Benign use of magical powers is perfectly acceptable as well, should anyone be moved.

CG, what do you expect? Capitulation? :F_05BL17blowkiss:

My rewind impressions on a day I'm majorly preoccupied elsewhere all have to do with how far he's come. I'll take Clay today over that Clay, as much as I have always loved AI Clay. Today's Clay is hawt, polished, multi-faceted, and did I mention, hawt. And still cute.

[annabear]

Good luck, jmh! :F_05BL17blowkiss:

[ldyjocelyn]

jmh, I'll be sending you all kinds of good luck tomorrow with my supra sekrit FCA mind meld powers!

CG, just remember:

"I'd rather try and fail, a thousand times denied....

At least whenever you feel pain, it lets you know you're alive..."

[atinal]

Good luck on the interview tomorrow jmh, and like good little Clay fans, if we could call and vote for you we would!!!!

[Claygasm]

jmh, I'll be sending you all kinds of good luck tomorrow with my supra sekrit FCA mind meld powers!

CG, just remember:

"I'd rather try and fail, a thousand times denied....

At least whenever you feel pain, it lets you know you're alive..."

Wow, Ldyj! What amazing words! Where did they come from?? They should be in song!

[Ansamcw]

Well CG you can give your opinion of course but then agree to disagree. But if you want to say that my conclusion is flawed based on your experience...then I am simply giving you the context from which I made my conclusion.

YUP...don;t get caught in an argument on the anomaly with a Clay internet fan...hee opinions are strong and set in stone.

good luck JMH!!!!

I agree...Clay came a long way in his performances and his look. He is also much better in interpreting the songs. But I do miss the purity of his voice that was evident then.

[jmh123]

Coincidentally, my favorite lines from the song.

[muskifest]

OOh...I've been peaking in on the discussion. From the info I've gleaned over the years from fans and from people on the show---Michael Orland and Nigel---I've come to believe this:

1. The songs in each person's bowl were particular to that bowl. It wasn't just one bowl with all three people just 'randomly' picking one song out of it. Each person's bowl had only four different songs, and they had been picked by the producers.

2. According to MIchael, he knew that Moon River and Vincent were in Clay's bowl because they were two songs that Nigel loved and he wanted to hear Clay sing them.

3. When Clay picked Vincent, all was well with the show because a) Clay was singing a song in his 'mold' (according to the producers) Kim had a good chance to 'catch' up with the guys, singing a song she'd already gotten raves for c) Ruben was singing a song that was upbeat and 'true' to his genre, too.

4. According to Michael Orland, Nigel wanted Vincent to go longer, ergo the last-minute added verse without rehearsal opportunity for Clay. Personally? I think that sucks donkey balls, teleprompter or not. As Clay said in the Rewind interview, it wasn't a matter of the words---it was the little matter of not having rehearsed how to come in with a verse he'd never even known was going to be part of the performance. Whatever.

5. The studio audience (and of course the judges) were told about the situation so they could judge Clay in the correct context. However, the voting public was not. What they got was Randy saying the song sucked (well, duh---I think Clay thought so, too); Paula lying and saying he forgot the words (although I applaud her for pointing out how well Clay saved the performance); and Simon giving him the thumbs down for a dreary rendition of a dreary song---a song that IS dreary, BTW, and the rendition grossly compromised by the last-minute change (not Clay's choice)...In fact, nothing about that song was Clay's choice.

Yep...the other two didn't choose their song, either....but I still don't think it was an even playing ground. And I think Nigel basically admitted that the show HAD to do something to try to even it, given the runaway lead Clay had every week from Wildcard on...No suspense, no need to watch, no high ratings.

So I'm sorta agreeing with everybody a bit. I DO think the bowl was manipulated and I DO think it was unfair of the producers to do a last minute change, without chance to rehearse, to only one of the contestants' songs; but I don't think it was because of any personal grudge against the person, Clay Aiken. I think it was all about the show---how they could make it 'closer'; since Clay was the clear vote leader (although the public didn't know that at the time, the producers did!), he was the one whose lead needed to be narrowed.

IMO, YMMV, etc. I think the think that killed me was the NEXT week---when we saw the two different dressing rooms for the two guys. I mean, puh-leeze. PINK? There was no other more appropriate room for Clay?

And that's that. Actually, I thought KLo sounded pretty good, Ruben struggled on all songs, IMO (And wouldn't it have been a trip if Clay had been given a chance at SSD back then? Woot! --I mean, let's see if we could imagine that Ruben would've made Vincent less 'dreary'.... ) and Clay was kicking butt on MTK and doing a good job on UM---I just remember whooping when he hit the falsetto! hee...

I think I thought the combination of the weird Vincent and that donkey ball sucking suit was going to do him in that night! :lmaosmiley-1:

Glad it didn't...'coss if anything's gonna do him in, I want it to be ME!

[playbiller]

A quick note on the anomoly. I was home on the performance night and voted kind of for the first time 2 hours on 3 phones auto dialing every 10 seconds starting just before they said you could and continuing after the lines were supposedly closed. Nada. I took a break on one phone and talked to my sister who was not getting anything through in NC. From the boards I gleaned that the cities were going for Ruben more than the subarbs which did not explain why I could not get through, since I am in a very urban area and share my exchange and a zip code with a major city. Chicago and Philly were big Ruben cities. But pretty much every where except the pacific north west, it was a Clay country.

Would a Could a Should a - if Clay had won.

I think he would have had excellent sales, people were waiting forthe album. Would people have bought multiples? Probably not or not as much, but the multiple buying people in 600K not that much, so a dent in the volume. .

I think:

the crazed side of the fandom would have not been quite as "enthusiastic" - a good thing

Simon would not have been allowed to say some thing he did which would have been good for Clay.

Clay would not have gotten those stupid loser remarks.

We would still be around, but maybe not attending quite as many multiples

There would have been charges of racial prejudice, it was sort of around beforethe finale

I used to think it was better Clay lost, now I am not so sure, I am wavering.

[clayzedover]

I just read on Clayversity that SCARLETT WAS TONIGHT'S PEASANT!!!!

[Couch Tomato]

I just read on Clayversity that SCARLETT WAS TONIGHT'S PEASANT!!!!

whoo hooo! Can't wait to hear all about it.

[muskifest]

I just read on Clayversity that SCARLETT WAS TONIGHT'S PEASANT!!!!

whoo hooo! Can't wait to hear all about it.

Wonder if Clay whipped out a video camera to take Sclack!

[cha cha trusty]

I just read on Clayversity that SCARLETT WAS TONIGHT'S PEASANT!!!!

whoo hooo! Can't wait to hear all about it.

Wonder if Clay whipped out a video camera to take Sclack!

Now I know why I've stayed up so late.... it must have been just to hear this news!!!

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

[footloose]

hey all!!! :new:

thought you animal lovers would be interested in this...

kellykellyk from CH wrote

If anyone wanted an autographed ATDW & TV Guide Cover, it seems Clay donated an autographed gift set for Miranda Lambert's 1st Annual Cause for the Paws.

Clay Aiken fans will LOVE this autographed gift set. It includes: 1 "A Thousand Different Ways CD", 1 TV Guide with Clay on the cover and 1 Magnet (not autographed). All autographs are clearly legible and the items are in excellent (new) condition.

This item was donated by Clay to be auctioned in conjunction with Miranda’s first charity event “Cause For The Paws”. All proceeds from this sale will be added to the incoming funds from her charity concert, live auction and silent auction on April 20th, 2008. We ask that you make payment for this purchase through paypal instantly or by phone credit card payment on Saturday April 19th. 10AM - 5 PM (903-882-9305) so the funds from this sale can be added to final event tally. The event will benefit The Humane Society of East Texas (former home of Miranda’s precious tour partner, Delilah – pictured). The Miranda Lambert Store and Beverly Lambert host this sale. Thank you for your participation in helping us care for abused, abandoned and unwanted animals.

it's currently going for $101 now. glad that Clay thought of the four-legged people too

http://stores.ebay.com/Miranda-Lambert-Store

[luckiest1]

I have a job interview tomorrow, all day. I just found out Thursday. ACK! But I did it, I'm ready, I'm incredibly prepared, and, I'm scared shitless. It's a great job, the best of any I've applied for in the last two years, and only the seond time out of dozens of applications that I've made it to the interview stage. It's one of my "dream jobs" since I moved here, but there hasn't been an opening til now. It really is a job ideally suited for me, and hopefully, I for them. But the competition is bound to be competitive, LOL. So please, send good vibes. Please!! Benign use of magical powers is perfectly acceptable as well, should anyone be moved.

Good luck! :F_05BL17blowkiss:

And wouldn't it have been a trip if Clay had been given a chance at SSD back then? Woot! --I mean, let's see if we could imagine that Ruben would've made Vincent less 'dreary'....

Now that I would have loved to have seen!

Congrats to Scarlett! Can't wait to read the recap.

ETA: Welcome, footloose!