#18: He has always had the VOICE! But, boy has he ever learned to use his instrument!

[rohdy]

I grew up with 39 first cousins, on my dad's side....in our teens....there was a lot of crushin' going on...complete with hand holdin'. Freaked our parents out, but even we knew when enough was enough.

That being said...whoever suggested Clay calling her his cousin, could be his attempt at hiding in plain sight...well...that sounds about right to me!

And it is such fun to speculate!!

And am I the only one who grew up referring to their dog as their pooch? LOL

[Scarlett]

"He won't sing about sex or use lyrics with innuendo"

It probably went over their heads. In Shrek, the gingerbread boy tells his torturer, "Eat me!" Very young kids would simply think "Eat - gingerbread boy" --> makes sense.

I don't think he said all that in RS..but it's been years since I read it.

It's an interesting dilemma Claygasm. You clearly wouldn't go but I've seen pretty good explanations from people who are going. I'd go to support Clay and Jesse if I could. There is more than one way to deal with this issue. They don't know Clay very well and it will be interesting to see if he says anything about any of this.... officially or during the concert. And maybe he won't address it directly but indirectly though what he does say. I'll be listening that's for sure.

I thought it was hilarious the way he said, "This is a military establishment. We have a don't ask, don't tell policy" at West Point last year. (In the context of not telling people who attended a Clay Aiken concert)

[Couch Tomato]

I have always looked at Clay as a decent guy who tries. That's all any of us can do.

The fact that everthing comes from the Enquirer, everything... well I just don't trust them at all. Sure I can go to their website and see what they preach...does that mean anyone who they rent their hall to has to fall in line with that. I can't even begin to fathom what's real and how any of Clay or his band feel about any of it. I just hate that people who want attention are actually getting some with this story.

I thought it was hilarious the way he said, "This is a military establishment. We have a don't ask, don't tell policy" at West Point last year. (In the context of not telling people who attended a Clay Aiken concert)

yep, that's the kind of thing I'm talkin' about Scarlett.

[Guest Toots]

As long as he's not gay by Christmas... :bigemo_harabe_net-24: Almost sounds like a joke and it may well be!

Why would he perform at a place like that with those attitudes? Wonder if he realizes what's going on.

[Couch Tomato]

As long as he's not gay by Christmas... Almost sounds like a joke and it may well be!

Why would he perform at a place like that with those attitudes? Wonder if he realizes what's going on.

It's commentary by the writer.

I wonder how this church/members/leadership feel about being in the spotlight like this.

[sheiladownunder]

As long as Clay is still not gay by Christmas, he will still be scheduled to perform.

I took this to be one of those stoopid comments by the Lycos author of the paragraph in a half assed attempt at humor.

ETA: I do have to add that I really do appreciate reading everyone's take on different things... interesting all the different perspectives...

Yes, you are correct, that last part was added by Lycos and was not said by the church.

I love Clay's poochy tummy but he could stand to lose just a few pounds and maybe some situps. I'd hate to see him get all thin again though, because I like the way his face, chest, arms, thighs and rear end look with some weight.

Like I can really talk about weight, but I'm twice his age and didn't put on my weight until the last 5 years, so he does need to start thinking about maintaining a healthy weight because it gets harder. I empathize with the medication part because that's what set off my weight gain, but my poor eating habits and lack of exercise don't help.

ETA I missed sending HUGS to {{{clayzor and hubby}}} and {{{zena and friend}}} and Happy Belated to laughn - I thought your joke was funny but we were talking about poochy tummies so I got confused and saw Ho-Hos and it made me hungry.

[ldyjocelyn]

Uncle!!!!!

I kept telling myself that I need another Clay message board to post at like a hole in the head.

I told myself that it was enough that I had found the message board and with it some of my favorite cyber-friends that I thought didn't post anymore.

I told myself it was enought to just read and laugh. Yup. That's what I said.

But then.....

Someone quoted Inigo Montoya (from The Princess Bride)

Someone else actually knows who Christine Lavin is!!!

Then someone else noted that they are following the same crazy CITH pattern that I am....Waukegan, Kalamazoo, D.C.

I give up. I don't post enough to worry about one more board anyway.

EEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!! Perma's in the house!!!! :F_05BL17blowkiss:

Need to reposted this on a new page...

Totally agree! He looks so....so....content and happy on that stage with the kids. *sigh*

As a friend said to me, how can you lust after a man whose belly sticks out further than his.... um, his Waldo!

But with Clay, his stomach would have to get AWFULLY big, wouldn't it?

As much as I agree with you CG about him being in a position of "image," I also think it is rather unfortunate that it is like that, that he can't just be a "normal weight guy" who happens to have a fantastic voice and a killer personality.

How can Clay go to a venue you like this???? How can Jesse???? How can anyone - Clay, the fans, anyone - support in any way a venue which is so intolerant and bigoted????

By showing people that are members of this church that people who are gay can also be talented; that people who are way talented can have gay friends and gay coworkers; and by showing love to those people....to all people. Yeah, it's a hard thing to do, and I don't like their "politics" either -- but Clay seems to "show rather than do" in his life, and by his example, maybe a few of those members of that church will understand and learn. One person at a time....

Or, I could just quote couchie....

I have always looked at Clay as a decent guy who tries. That's all any of us can do.

BTW, I'm one of 39 cousins on my Dad's side. We're not close, per se, but in my mind, we're FAMILY. "Cousins" = "family" = "off limits." EVEN if it is by marriage. And like CG and KAndre[/] said, I think if he didn't consider her family, he'd introduce her simply as his hairdresser.

[Guest Toots]

I see lot's of new bodies for our weight thread!

[liney23]

Well, I'm looking at the bright side... they actually said what he said in RS that he was not gay. We haven't seen too much of that and I am very happy that was there. I also thought the comment about if he is still not gay by Christmas, he'll be there was an attempt at humor.

OT, a bit... just watching Monday Night Football. Jimmy Kimmel is going to sub for Regis next week. I hope he puts his hand over her mouth!!!

I wonder if there will be angst that Clay's friend would do this.

[ialreadyam]

What is the significance of "red guy" Surely someone can relate the back-story. Please?

I asked this earlier today. Doesn't anyone know the answer? :8:

[jamar1700]

What is the significance of "red guy" Surely someone can relate the back-story. Please?

I asked this earlier today. Doesn't anyone know the answer? :8:

uhhh as I understand it... couchTOMATO ... therefore ---->

[Cotton]

G'night, All!

[Bookwhore]

I empathize with the medication part because that's what set off my weight gain, but my poor eating habits and lack of exercise don't help.

Personally, I hold Milton Hershey responsible. I blame it all on him.

What is the significance of "red guy" Surely someone can relate the back-story. Please?

I asked this earlier today. Doesn't anyone know the answer? :8:

I think 'red guy' is actually 'red gal'.....isn't that couchtomato?

[Couch Tomato]

Oh I think Cindilu made that emoticon and when she introduced it ..there was lots of laughter about Vegi tales..and then some realized it looked like a tomato. No big significansce....just kinda adopted it....and it was on one of the t-shirts during DCAT. Sorry I didn't answer sooner!!

Like I can really talk about weight, but I'm twice his age and didn't put on my weight until the last 5 years, so he does need to start thinking about maintaining a healthy weight because it gets harder. I empathize with the medication part because that's what set off my weight gain, but my poor eating habits and lack of exercise don't help.

Sheiladownunder I was chatting with Ansa earlier and I said the same thing.... this is something I don't say much about because I can only thank the goddess that I don't have live that part of my life through a microscope. But with Clay, everything he does is watched closely and this will be no different. He cracks me up how he jokes about it though. I agree with everything else you said.

[ialreadyam]

Thanks for the answers. I assumed that it was couchie. :F_05BL17blowkiss:

[Ansamcw]

Glad you started posting permaswooned.

As a friend said to me, how can you lust after a man whose belly sticks out further than his.... um, his Waldo!

Since lusting after him is not a major driver for my fandom...there is no problem for me. I love his voice...his spirit...his humor...his looks is a big plus, but is just an added bonus so its not a big deal for me. I guess for people that needs to lust after him...this can be a problem.

I also don't think it looks as big as a beer gut to me. Just looks like he does not go to gym.

How can Clay go to a venue you like this???? How can Jesse???? How can anyone - Clay, the fans, anyone - support in any way a venue which is so intolerant and bigoted????

By showing people that are members of this church that people who are gay can also be talented; that people who are way talented can have gay friends and gay coworkers; and by showing love to those people....to all people. Yeah, it's a hard thing to do, and I don't like their "politics" either -- but Clay seems to "show rather than do" in his life, and by his example, maybe a few of those members of that church will understand and learn. One person at a time....

Or, I could just quote couchie....

I have always looked at Clay as a decent guy who tries. That's all any of us can do.

WORD ldyJ...I do not think intolerance is the right answer to intolerance. That will just result in hostility in both sides because no one wants to reach out and understand. For groups that are totally closed minded like the pure fashion people who didn't even give Clay the benefit of a doubt...I don't try and waste time on them. But when a Church is willing to have a performer that is rumored to be gay and has gay people in his show...this tells me that there is an opening there for change. Yes they do not agree with the gay lifestyle, they consider this a sin. But this mindset has gone on for a long time and it will not change over night. I do believe having performers like Clay and having this "controversy" open up discussion in this church that will hopefully open a few minds. I doubt it will change the churches stance but maybe open the minds of some of the members...specially the young people.

hee I was going to answer the tomato question...thanks Jamar...

that emoticon was created by cindilu2...we just thought it was so cute and a good representative of couchie...so we adopted him as a mascot.

[sheiladownunder]

Where is the weight thread BTW, I need some help.

There is a program on autism on nightline that just started.

[Couch Tomato]

Where is the weight thread BTW, I need some help.

I just moved it to personal chit chat forum

I changed the name too...cuz first I was shaping up for DCAT.then I was shaping up for Xmas tour... notice the pattern

[liney23]

sheila, it is under Personal Chit Chat.

Ohhh, couchie beat me AND made a link. Show off...

But, she didn't tell you it was under "Watercooler".

[Couch Tomato]

sheila, it is under Personal Chit Chat.

Ohhh, couchie beat me AND made a link. Show off...

But, she didn't tell you it was under "Watercooler".

'

you know I can't wait to meet some of you at the various places I'll be - vegas, minneapolise, omaha, merrillville. It will be nice to put the smartass names to faces

[laughn]

How can Clay go to a venue you like this???? How can Jesse???? How can anyone - Clay, the fans, anyone - support in any way a venue which is so intolerant and bigoted????

By showing people that are members of this church that people who are gay can also be talented; that people who are way talented can have gay friends and gay coworkers; and by showing love to those people....to all people. Yeah, it's a hard thing to do, and I don't like their "politics" either -- but Clay seems to "show rather than do" in his life, and by his example, maybe a few of those members of that church will understand and learn. One person at a time....

Or, I could just quote couchie....

I have always looked at Clay as a decent guy who tries. That's all any of us can do.

WORD ldyJ...I do not think intolerance is the right answer to intolerance. That will just result in hostility in both sides because no one wants to reach out and understand. For groups that are totally closed minded like the pure fashion people who didn't even give Clay the benefit of a doubt...I don't try and waste time on them. But when a Church is willing to have a performer that is rumored to be gay and has gay people in his show...this tells me that there is an opening there for change. Yes they do not agree with the gay lifestyle, they consider this a sin. But this mindset has gone on for a long time and it will not change over night. I do believe having performers like Clay and having this "controversy" open up discussion in this church that will hopefully open a few minds. I doubt it will change the churches stance but maybe open the minds of some of the members...specially the young people.

I bolded a couple things.

I have always seen Clay as a 'lead by example' kind of guy also. I think he mentioned that is how he sees religion as well when he spoke about considering joining the Moravian church...in LTS I think. I just imagine him the same in all aspects of life. If you're trained as a teacher, you're trained to be a role model. I think it's natural for him.

As for the church...I would love to think that Clay and Co., just by the act of being there and being who they are, could affect a change for some members who have a narrow view of the world. That is something that I hadn't considered and the thought made me smile.

[YSRN]

I took this to be one of those stoopid comments by the Lycos author of the paragraph in a half assed attempt at humor.

I didn't think it was a stoopid comment. I thought it was sarcasm from Lycos to roll their eyes at the stance of the church... like he's not gay now and as long as he doesn't change, it's still on.

I understood from the Kansas news station that they went to the church and confirmed the original letter was written by the pastor -- IF TRUE, it implied to me that Clay was checked out and was deemed "acceptable"... and that this was an outreach event, where they hope to bring the lost sheep into the fold. Which bothers me. I accept and respect the beliefs of most religions, but evangelism is a crossed line for me. Especially when it also involves efforts to legislate. I have a zillion thoughts and this babbling distillation isn't doing them justice, but I don't want to get too deep into this here. I wouldn't be going to this show; I think that's a personal decision that everyone can make and not be judged for it.

WORD ldyJ...I do not think intolerance is the right answer to intolerance. That will just result in hostility in both sides because no one wants to reach out and understand. For groups that are totally closed minded like the pure fashion people who didn't even give Clay the benefit of a doubt...I don't try and waste time on them. But when a Church is willing to have a performer that is rumored to be gay and has gay people in his show...this tells me that there is an opening there for change. Yes they do not agree with the gay lifestyle, they consider this a sin. But this mindset has gone on for a long time and it will not change over night. I do believe having performers like Clay and having this "controversy" open up discussion in this church that will hopefully open a few minds. I doubt it will change the churches stance but maybe open the minds of some of the members...specially the young people.

I'd like to think this way... I can't say I do 100%, but I'd like to. So thanks for expressing the thought. Not that I don't agree that intolerance + more intolerance isn't the answer, but, I don't believe the church is "willing" nor that there is any opening for change... Not after reading their newletters. Truthfully...being the heathen that I am, some of the depth of this mindset is totally new to me... I'll show my ignorance in saying here that I am still in a bit of shock that these megachurches even exist in the quantity they do. I'm in learning mode on this one. Doesn't help that I just watched Jesus Camp. Eep! I know that is not representative of all Christian thought and I know this church isn't either... But I'm not thrilled with this particular church's documented "politics". Nope, not thrilled at all. BUT, buying a ticket to a show there doesn't lock me into buying into their beliefs either, so it's gotta come down to personal choice... as always. Yep, still not going. But I hope a few people learn a thing or two. I'll hope for the best. And try to remember that every person there in an individual, not a group of one mind. I hope.

WooT... Go Cleveland!!

Oh, and never believe laughn when she tells you she's going to bed. She lies!!!

Welcome to Perma and SLC!

[KAndre]

I love Clay's poochy tummy but he could stand to lose just a few pounds and maybe some situps. I'd hate to see him get all thin again though, because I like the way his face, chest, arms, thighs and rear end look with some weight.

See, I don't get where he could stand to lose a few pounds - he doesn't look particular fit - but he really does look on the lower end of an acceptable weight range for his height. For a 6' 1" guy with a medium frame anything from 151-182 is good according to Weight Watchers. If he weighed 160 at his chunkiest I'd be shocked. I tend to really like how Clay doesn't seem to really worry about his hair or poochy tummy or pasty skin or occasionally nonexistant eyebrows. I think he has enough food issues with the allergies - I'd hate to see him get all male modelish about his lack of a six pack.

As for the Lycos thingie - it's not like not being a drunken, foul-mouthed womanizer is a bad thing. The not gay by Christmas? Sounds like a smart-assed joke. I laughed.

[YSRN]

I laughed.

Me too. But I'm the only one who laughed at all those Blender descriptions, aren't I?

[keepingfaith]

In order to try and win myself a welcome, I thought I would drop off a present. In honor of all the eHP members here, it's from the Houston DCAT.

Any stubble fans here???

...nervously hits submit....

Stubble fans? You're looking for stubble fans?

And what is more ....

I'm so glad you're posting here, PermaSwooned! I don't know if you remember meeting me after the concert in WPB, but I remember talking to you (and somebody from Oklahoma that I can't remember her name) -- but I remember both your lovely faces! We were all definitely swooning that night!!!

Your photographs are divine. That scruffy patch under his chin where the light hits it just right .....