#34: So, how about that Clay Aiken?

[Iseeme]

Morning everyone.

This made me spit Wheaties...

she said that she heard something about him having a baby with a middle-aged man

Now THAT would be something to talk about!!!!

Laughn - glad you're feeling better.

Sebastian you little dickens - glad you're peeing!

On the subject of formal voice training, etc. I think that's why Josh Groban doesn't appeal to me - I feel like he's trained! trained! trained! and there isn't much heart going on in there. As I said before, I saw him in concert and all he did was stand at the microphone and open his mouth. No personality. Not much delivery...although he does have a beautiful voice! I thought he was more interesting when he had a girlfriend named January! Hee.

[FromClaygary]

Really enjoyed the discussion about voice technique! I also had noticed the points in WIDTL that others referred to; I don't know whether it's deliberate or accidental of course, but I've always thought of that sound as Clay going from (X song) to "mac n cheese". By the looks of Gibby's explanation, perhaps I'm not far wrong.

To get me through all this and to get me to, you know, relax, I would slap on my headphones and turn Clay on (don't I wish) and fall off to sleep listening. My friend bottlecap :F_05BL17blowkiss: put a whole bunch of Clay onto my MP3 player.

Beautifully said! Hope you are recuperating as we speak!

Ooops! Lost a quote beginning, but luckiest1 said:

Check out the new June wallpapers on cindilu2's yuku site:

http://cindilu2.theclayboard.yuku.com/

Love, love, love the June 08 v. 2 one - the smile is just what I need every time I turn on the computer. And the words are perfect too.

Hee....the EXACT one I have on my desktop right now.

Had to add, from iseeme above:

On the subject of formal voice training, etc. I think that's why Josh Groban doesn't appeal to me - I feel like he's trained! trained! trained! and there isn't much heart going on in there.

That's it exactly!!

[liney23]

It's going to be impossible to catch up, so I'm just going to post. I need to give bottlecap a thank you out here, and it's long over due. I'm just going to copy over the bulk of my post at getclayaiken because i am too tired for anything else.

My son and daughter in law asked about the news the day after we heard it on TMZ. They read about it onlone. They simply were happy for him. They were most surprised that it was his executive producer for some reason. lol.

The last few days I have found myself recovering from a rather painful surgery. On top of that, I was doing most of that recovery in a ward where there were a lot of hurtin' people around me. Some woman named Pat never stopped screaming and moaning. Really. Never. Stopped. They even had a psych. guy come in and try to talk ducks and geese and pretty clouds and stuff to her to get her mind off the pain. PG, "Just think of all those cute baby geese out there on the lawn" Pat, "aghhhhhhhh" PG, "I bet they're enjoying the warm weather" Pat, "aghhhhhhh" PG, "I imagine they like staying close to their mom" Pat, "aghhhhhhh"

You get the idea.

So, what does this story have to do with Clay Aiken? Well, I'll tell you, (TM Prince Herbert)

To get me through all this and to get me to, you know, relax, I would slap on my headphones and turn Clay on (don't I wish) and fall off to sleep listening. My friend bottlecap :F_05BL17blowkiss: put a whole bunch of Clay onto my MP3 player. OMWH and just random stuff. Three different times I woke up when I got to AOL Sessions MOAM. Somewhere in there I would think in my very addled, drug soaked head, that I was listening to the most beautiful sounds on earth. Once I remember thinking I was in church or something. Not everything was making sense. I just knew each time that I was listening to something out of this world beautiful. Then I would drift back to sleep. I woke up once for The Prayer too. My point? Shit, do I have one??!?

It doesn't matter to me if Clay is going to be a daddy. More power to him. If he wants to talk about it to us, the fans, I'll listen. If he doesn't, I won't. I just want him to keep singing pretty angel music to me. That's all I need. If there is a heaven, and I make it there someday, and the angels don't sound like Clay Aiken, I'm going to be pissed and feel a little cheated.

laughn... {{{{hugs and well wishes for a very speedy recovery}}}} Laughter is good... I know this REALLY funny series someone wrote about waking Clay up in the mornings that just cracks me up everytime I read them... :F_05BL17blowkiss:

Lovely post, laughn.

Especially after reading elsewhere that Clay is only being quiet so he can sell this to the highest bidder for PR purposes.

djs...

[Iseeme]

Sell the story to the highest bidder - sheesh! Yup. Our Clay is all about money.............................NOT!

I know there are some on this board that really like Josh Groban and I wasn't putting him down - just stating a preference. But I'm still wishing for a refund of the $90+ I paid to see him. I think it's perfectly okay to like/love/listen to other performers besides Clay. I downloaded a mix last night from iTunes to listen to in the car on the way to Tahoe this weekend and it included everything from Clay to Annie Lennox to K.D. Lang, David Cook and Coldplay. Very eclectic song choices. I lurves iTunes.

Cindilu's wallpaper is gorgeous. My new background is gorgeous as a result. Thank you Cindi! :F_05BL17blowkiss: I love that little bit of a crease near his mouth that is almost a grin.....

[annabear]

Welcome home, {{{{laughn}}}}. :F_05BL17blowkiss:

[Couch Tomato]

If Clay were so calculating, he could have used this story to negotiate all sorts of appearances and cover stories just one month ago when they would have helped him enormously.

Laughn...thanks for your post. It was beautiful. So lucky to have a friend like Bottle, even if she teases you unmercifully. To Laughn and Bottle :F_05BL17blowkiss:

[KAndre]

I dunno - me personally, I like a lot of old school trained voices and also good perfection - roughness or imperfection in and of themselves don't thrill me or add authenticity to me (which is also why I hate that "antiquing" stuff - you know, battering a perfectly good new piece to make it look like something you should throw away - I like shiny and new looking! I like old that looks like you took freaking care of it. And "homemade" looking stuff - I can't get past the fact if you were really skilled, it would look perfect. But then again, I don't mind machine made either.).

If the performance called for a different texture on purpose, that's different - but just sounding bad due to poor technique or lack of talent (not Clay, people!) just doesn't whip my panties off. It's like the only song I like by Bob Dylan sung by Bob Dylan is the one where he has the flash cards. I think he's singing. Otherwise, I especially like his stuff when other people are singing it. Like the Animals. I know, kf, I know - I'm a TOTAL heathen.

Me, I fuckin' love the pretty. And Clay brings the pretty consistantly.

[claytonic]

gelfling Jun 2nd, 2008 at 8:07 pm

foxydonna Jun 2nd, 2008 at 5:43 pm

TMZ has posted a pic of Clay baby mama out and about. Looks pretty good for 50.

Probably because she isn’t 50. Her name isn’t Eileen Foster either, as that asshole Friedman reports but hey, its tabloid media.

Her name is Colleen Jaymes Foster and she wasn’t named after her father whose name isn’t James.

Source: http://mjsbigblog.com/idol-headlines-for-60208.htm

:cryingwlaughter:

[djs111]

Mistress KAndre said:

It's like the only song I like by Bob Dylan sung by Bob Dylan is the one where he has the flash cards. I think he's singing. Otherwise, I especially like his stuff when other people are singing it. Like the Animals. I know, kf, I know - I'm a TOTAL heathen

Dang! Can I still be a minion if I prefer Dylan's version of ALL of his songs to covers? I don't think anyone else phrases his songs as well as he does. I understand that many many people do not care for his voice - but he does sing in tune, which can't be said for many today. I find his recording of "Ring Them Bells", for example, just blows away any other prettified covers of it. He makes me listen to the words.

[Iseeme]

My favorite Dylan song is Things I've Changed from the movie Wonder Boys. I believe it also won the Academy Award for Best Song that year!!! And who can forget Lay, Lady, Lay!

As for that blog - couldn't find the picture. But Jaymes IS 50. Weren't the Roberts at her 50th birthday party when they chimed in on the situation? And do you think if this is true that it brings a new definition to Executive Producer? Sorry - I just had to do that! Hee.

[atinal]

Moringing thoughts:

-laughn, I'm glad you're feeling better. Loved your story. It's a shame that someone didn't load up an MP3 player for Pat.

-I miss cindilu

-I had the first person mention the story to me. He's the husband of a good friend who has attended 3 Christmas shows with me. He said, hey, atina what about Clay, hesitated only a second or two and then said, he's gonna be a daddy. I said, yeah that's what I hear and followed it up with, he loves kids and has said in interviews he really wants to be a dad. That was it.

-KAndre, I'm with you on Dylan. I think the man has written some truely great stuff, but I like most of it better sung by other people. Several years back he had a resurgence in popularity and was singing on one of the awards shows. I honestly couldn't understand a single word that he sang, but he was getting praised out the waazoo for his latest album. I had an album or two of his back in the 60's and there are a few songs that wouldn't sound quite the same if Dylan wasn't singing them.

[muskifest]

laughn---glad you're recovering and THIS brought a big smile to me:

If there is a heaven, and I make it there someday, and the angels don't sound like Clay Aiken, I'm going to be pissed and feel a little cheated.

Gibby--thanks for the music lesson and what you said makes all kinds of sense to me. Although I've never had voice lessons, I've always sung in school and community choirs and have had a go at singing "professionally" in my 20's---in nightclubs, dinner dance places, etc. I know some vocal technique and understand the closed/open palate/throat thing. That pretty much explains the sounds I'm talking about...and Cotton, yep--Clay's tendency to stretch his neck out and lift his chin DOES contribute to those sounds.

Clay's voice is truly unique, IMO. I agree with whoever said that the AOL sessions of MOAM can bring me to tears---in a good way. Yet if you get technical about it, you know he broke on a note here, didn't quite 'make' a note there. That's NOT why there's music though, is it? To give us something to 'dissect'. Music is glorious and should make us FEEL and Clay's voice certainly does that. I suppose if I could have ONE change in Clay's voice, it would be less of this 'strident' or nasally sound that he uses (ostensibly because of his placement of the vowel as Gibby explained). I LOVE how he sounds on LAA and love the 'open' quality of his voice there. Sometimes notes that he sings literally make me gasp because of their richness and depth and fullness and timbre---he CAN do it. And yes, it is the imperfect pattern of his vocal delivery that adds to his uniqueness.

Add that all to the fact that we absolutely adore this man for so many other reasons and you've got one humongous blessing named Clay Aiken!

Dang! I was all excited that there might be a picture of well-hung Clay in that TMZ article. If they'd claimed that about Clay, I might have to reconsider their history of printing the truth!

[Iseeme]

Whoa - this is interesting. Apparently ET KNEW the story about Brangelina's twins being born was a hoax before they aired it! Now they're doing all sorts of back-pedaling including saying they didn't find out their source was an imposter until 3 days after the story was broadcast. Gotta love the Fourth Estate these days - it sucks!

http://www.comcast.net/articles/tv/2008060...ia.Jolie.Birth/

Psssst......Muski....shhhhh.....I have more pictures in my photobucket.....heh! heh!

[luckiest1]

Still no mentions of the story yet from family or friends. It gets interestinger and interestinger to me. And interestinger is so a word!

I've been surfing around a bit and I'm reading some angst about whether or not Clay is OK. There seems to be a prevailing feeling that if he'd just blog, or make a statement, or something, it'd make things better, ease some minds. Help people stop worrying about him, stop perhaps believing some of the seedier versions of the story floating around out there. Some people even seem to think he's misrepresented himself in some way over the years. I'm not judging, or at least I'm trying not to, but I'm just really quite surprised and a bit overwhelmed at some of what I'm reading. And all that keeps going through my mind are the lyrics to this old song.

When the road gets dark

And you can no longer see

Just let my love throw a spark

And have a little faith in me

And when the tears you cry

Are all you can believe

Just give these loving arms a try

And have a little faith in me

And

Chorus:

Have a little faith in me

Have a little faith in me

Have a little faith in me

Have a little faith in me

When your secret heart

Cannot speak so easily

Come here darlin

From a whisper start

To have a little faith in me

And when your backs against the wall

Just turn around and you will see

I will catch, I will catch your fall baby

Just have a little faith in me

Chorus

Sung over fade:

Well, Ive been loving you for such a long time girl

Expecting nothing in return

Just for you to have a little faith in me

You see time, time is our friend

cause for us there is no end

And all you gotta do is have a little faith in me

I said I will hold you up, I will hold you up

Your love gives me strength enough

So have a little faith in me

He is the same man he's always been. Give him time to deal with this in his own way, the way that is best for him, for Jaymes, and for the baby (regardless of paternity). I just hope the fandom at large can have a little faith in him.

[claytonic]

...I immediately thought of all sorts of babies in the world who are coming into the world with so much more crappiness. Born into poverty, for example. Or, babies born when their parents really don't want them to begin with, and are then destined to a life of abuse and neglect. Recent story in our area: a mother and her boyfriend were arrested...for they left their 5 month old child strapped in a baby-bounce seat for over a week.

When I think about things like that, I feel that this possible Clay/Jaymes collaboration will be filled with love, and will be able to deal with the pitiful crap that the media throws at them.

I so totally agree. That story about the 5 month old... makes my blood boil!! It is enough grounds to force the parents into sterilization. Most children born into special circumstances like Clay and Jaymes are loved and have a happy childhood. At the end of the day, it's not about anything or anyone else but the child. That is all that matters.

ETA Luckiest, LOVE that pic of your kitties.

[KAndre]

Brace yourself, people - I was thinking! About some fans' reaction to the possible Clay Jaymes thingie, and it made me think of the various types of love. I found these descriptions a while back and they resonate with me more than the classic ones of eros, agape and philia (maybe 'cause they're like, greek to me. Heh.)

SECURITY LOVE - Deep caring and nurturing. Basic, instinctive, and critical for survival. Parental type love (can be applied to lots of things beside children).

FRIENDSHIP LOVE - A love between yourself and someone that is totally honest, open and comfortable. Serious trust. You are really you with these people, warts and all. You really only have this kind of bond with a few people.

ROMANTIC LOVE - What the poets sing about. It is when you see that person for the first time and he/she makes your knees go weak or gives you butterflies in your stomach; .i.e. "Love at first sight”. Occasionally the idea of being in love. A more lustful kind of love. Most people experience this type of love many times in their life. What people seem to think is missing from the Clay/Jaymes pairing. A little (no, let me be honest here), a LOT overrated in my opinion. It can deepen into the following - but mostly it doesn't.

UNCONDITIONAL LOVE - Not even much the Clay thing - it's sort of a combination of the security and friendship that spells a committment with a capital C - the love that might have you makin' babies after thinking hard about it (as opposed to almost a side effect of the Romantic stuff) - or sticking with someone who can't make babies - or doesn't wanna make babies - or is too old - or too young - or they are paralyzed from the neck down and can't have sex - or you HATE their entire family - or all sorts of things that make you fall out of Romantic love toot sweet. You can have the lust thing - but it isn't really necessary.

I'm wondering if Clay is one of those who really just isn't into the whole Romantic love thing. Lord knows, I'm not. It seems a lot of effort for not a lot of reward. We who don't really care about Romantic love tend not to discuss it, because lord knows that ones who do care seem to be fairly obsessed with it, and we have found it safer to avoid the obssessive types. Not being into Romantic doesn't preclude loving and enjoying children and sex and family and sex and expensive jewelry and sex and sex and sex - it's just that involving a lot of heart palpitations ain't exactly the end-all and be-all.

Of course, I'm projecting like crazy! But good crazy, not crazy crazy.

[Iseeme]

Well, since it was brought up......

I don't think Clay has misrepresented himself. Because he's only told us what he wanted to tell us and many have interpreted him or projected on him feelings or thoughts or actions they want him to think or do. I DO think he loves children. I DO think he's always wanted a family and children. But I always assumed family and children meant in the conventional manner. So therefore my assumption might be wrong - not his representation of what he wants. I think he would make an awesome father and would or will love a child completely. IIT - the only way I'll be disappointed in him is if he lives 3000 miles or so away from that child and only has visitations. Somehow this doesn't synch with MY PERSONAL OPINION of how Clay would approach fatherhood - long-distance parenting. And if this was done out of friendship only, what happens if he meets someone and falls in love and gets married. Seems like it would be a bit awkward.

Bottom line for me is I cannot believe in any stretch of the imagination that Clay lies! I just can't. So I believe what he says - whether it's about his lifestyle or the fact that he hates avocado.

[wandacleo]

Nobody is stuck in time.

Clay may have learned to like avocados. Does that make him a liar?

I don't think, though, that people's characters change without GREAT effort, self-awareness, and (probably) therapy.

So, I don't take everything that Clay has said as gospel for the whole of his life.

But, I know a good man when I see one.

Sufficient for me.

[muskifest]

Iseeme---thanks, but I have some interesting photos in my pic account, too...heh. I was just hoping that one of that kind of Clay pic was on TMZ instead of the Jenna BUsh pic, you know?

Oh, and Gibby, you are correct: My interestingly endowed man was indeed Austrian, not Austrailian. In fact, I've lovingly nicknamed him my Austrian Alp.

Oh, and 00lsee, you are correct: Even though he IS Austrian, he did enjoy a few trips Down Under. (as did I)

That article about ET is interesting. And someone elsewhere a few days ago linked to a story about the increasing (and troubling) influence these tabloid/blog/entertainment sites and shows have on actual NEWS reporting (ie, AP and Newsweek, etc.). I do believe that eventually our society will arrive at a saturation point of these bottom feeders and they'll die (hopefully, a very agonizing and merciless death); unfortunately, on their way to their own Hell, they're making life hell for people undeserving of such shit.

Ok...let me get my media player turned on and Clay's imperfect but perfectly wonderful voice filling me up. (heh) later, peeps! :F_05BL17blowkiss:

[Couch Tomato]

Bingo Wanda, Clay is often held to words he said 5 years ago. That's just wrong because everyone changes.

[Iseeme]

Wandacleo said:

Nobody is stuck in time.

Clay may have learned to like avocados. Does that make him a liar?

I have no idea what you meant with that comment. I was merely saying I believed what he said. Of course people change with time and maybe he did learn to love avocados but it was just a silly example.....sheesh! My point was I've always believed him when he said he wanted a family and children. HIS idea of what that meant isn't necessarily what MY idea is of what that meant.......so I don't feel he was misrepresenting himself. I might have been projecting.

[claytonic]

UNCONDITIONAL LOVE - Not even much the Clay thing - it's sort of a combination of the security and friendship that spells a committment with a capital C - the love that might have you makin' babies after thinking hard about it (as opposed to almost a side effect of the Romantic stuff) - or sticking with someone who can't make babies - or doesn't wanna make babies - or is too old - or too young - or they are paralyzed from the neck down and can't have sex - or you HATE their entire family - or all sorts of things that make you fall out of Romantic love toot sweet. You can have the lust thing - but it isn't really necessary.

Honestly, I don't believe unconditional love exists except between mother and child. Sometimes between father and child but never between a man and a woman, friends and family outside the mother and child bond. Think about it. Relationships are always conditional.

[ldyjocelyn]

KAndre, I like your analysis of "love," and I think it does a good job of signifying how many of us deal with these different kinds of love.

To wit [TM King Arthur]...

When I met my husband, I was all about the "romantic love." It was fantastic to have the hearts and flowers and dinners and "dressing up and dancing" and the "undressing and dancing of a different sort." It made us both feel special, and we got married because of that romantic love.

Now, 10 years into marriage, the romance is still there -- but our love is much more of the unconditional sort. I look at my husband and giggle at his silly jokes, rather than worry if he's going to bring me flowers anytime soon. Right now, we've both got major stresses in our jobs -- and yet, I can't imagine leaving my husband if something happens to our work related activities.

How does this relate to Clay? In a way, we've been on the same kind of journey, to me. 2003 and 2004 was exciting and fresh and constant. "We" felt the passion, and IMO Clay did too. But through the course of 5 years, the relationship (I hate to use that word, but I can't think of anything else) has changed. IMO, some are dealing with it quite well, and are now more in the unconditional stage. IMO, some are thinking of divorce. It's just the way all of us deal with love, and that is pretty darn varied. Nothing is "right" or "wrong," per se.

Iseeme, I too made the assumption that his having children would be through the, shall we say, more traditional route, or at most, via adoption. So yeah, this past week (has it been a week already?!?!?) has been a mind-blower for me. In a way, I'm surprised at myself, for I find I'm really more accepting of this than I originally thought it would be. I will say though that the "doing this for friendship" thing doesn't mean that Clay couldn't find that special someone and have children with them too. Yeah, it may be awkward -- but there's lots of blended families that have worked past "awkward" into "love."

OK, I'm done philosophizing for the day.

[JennaZ]

I don't think Clay has misrepresented himself. Because he's only told us what he wanted to tell us and many have interpreted him or projected on him feelings or thoughts or actions they want him to think or do. I DO think he loves children. I DO think he's always wanted a family and children. But I always assumed family and children meant in the conventional manner. So therefore my assumption might be wrong - not his representation of what he wants. I think he would make an awesome father and would or will love a child completely.

I agree with this. We, as fans, create our own image and expectations of him. If something seems to contradict that, I tend to think it's more the result of our own filters than any deception on his part.

However, I also think that a person's goals and expectations can change over time, and can be influenced by new developments in life. I can believe that he's expanded his definition of family in the last few years. I can also believe that he still wants a traditional family for himself. Personally, I don't think having a child with Jaymes necessarily means that he's "given up" or that he cannot have one in the future.

And if this was done out of friendship only, what happens if he meets someone and falls in love and gets married. Seems like it would be a bit awkward.

IMHO, it would only be as awkward as one allows it to be. Many fathers who were previously married, or never married the mother of their child, continue relationships with their children, and it doesn't necessarily ruin their relationship with their current spouse. This isn't exactly the same situation, but I tend to believe that Clay wouldn't commit to someone who could not accept his relationship with his own child, no matter how conceived or with whom. And I do think there are many women out there who are secure enough in themselves, and who have a good heart, who can accept a man's relationship with a child born outside the marriage.

[djs111]

I have no idea what you meant with that comment. I was merely saying I believed what he said. Of course people change with time and maybe he did learn to love avocados but it was just a silly example.....sheesh! My point was I've always believed him when he said he wanted a family and children. HIS idea of what that meant isn't necessarily what MY idea is of what that meant.......so I don't feel he was misrepresenting himself. I might have been projecting.

Heee....I don't think it happens here, but on other boards there really are people who believe that since Clay joked about not liking avocados:

He will never eat them ever

He would never have a relationship with an avocado lover

He would never eat in a restaurant that serves avocados

He would never buy a house with an avocado tree in the yard

The nutrient content of avocados is listed and Clay is reprimanded for not eating them

And is sent books and lists about what he should eat

Faye will be blamed for Clay not liking avocados

Faye just prolly prepared avocados incorrectly when Clay was a poor pitiful child, because those southerners don't know how to fix or appreciate good food

Clay is only saying he doesn't like avocados because he wants the California Avocado Association to pay big bucks for him to recant and say he loves them now

Saying he hates avocados is a sekrit signal to fake baby mamas

Saying he hates avocados means some tortuous intrusive clue about Santa M.....sorry, just typing that makes me pukle

Saying he hates avocados means he is leaving RCA

There will be a thread at OFC denouncing his disdain for avocados

There will be a thread at OFC praising him for hating avocados and showing support for Cesar Chavez

I honestly could continue for another 20 minutes, but SOME people have deliberately and willfully chosen to regard my humorous sense of irony as, um, sarcasm......

If he is seen eating avocado:

He is a liar

He prolly lied about OTHER STUFF TOO

He has betrayed his fans, who have given up avocados in a show of support

Some of us just get an uncontrollable tic when we hear how Clay hates something :-O

(edited because my sense of irony does not reside in a bone in my arm)