#36: It ain't my life, just my passion!

[liney23]

Bottom line for me? I love the man and his mad talent, and I have faith in him and his ability to steer his own course. He's hawt and sings purdy and does really good things for other people.

What's not to love?

muski... he sure has a verra verra niiiice steerer, doesn't he!

[spikesmom]

Agree with Cindy, Luckiest, Play and Tijala; to me; the biggest problem regarding the online fandom is the lack of respect for Clay; his family and associates at times. You can disagree with something Clay has said or done or not like his background singers or how his hair is on any given day...but do it respectfully. It is the tone and choice of words that annoys me.

Kim

Yes, I'd agree with this - especially when it comes to Clay. I don't have a problem with people not liking something about him (his words, his hair, his clothes, a particular song, etc.) and stating those facts. But some of the things said are downright nasty... and these are supposed to be "fan" boards? I get that he doesn't read here and the boards are for the fans, but with some of the stuff I've read, I'm stunned these people even consider themselves fans and stick around...

And geez, I made a not nice comment about Clive once, I'm not a fan - I don't hate him either and I still feel bad about that... do not these "fans" of Clay not feel anything about being so mean?

[cha cha trusty]

Anybody want to go back to Broadway?

Daniel Radcliffe is going to Bare his Body!!! (again)

http://www.ifmagazine.com/new.asp?article=6420

Clay-related......... ain't he HOT??

[cha cha trusty]

My middle DD liked Clay on AI. She was disappointed in ATDW. Was wanting him to sound more like he did on Idol only she can't define what she means by that. I think AI was sooo exciting... to watch him change and just keep singing the heck out of every song he picked made many think that his cds would be the same way, not realizing that the accompanying excitement wouldn't be there and that has affected the number of people buying his cds. Not sure I'm explaining this too well, but I just know my DD hasn't liked anything he's done since Idol and can't explain why.

I think someone once called it the WOW! factor. Clay had it every week on Idol so people got used to it and expected it from him in everything he did. When he turned into a not-on-Idol singer with some WOW and some wow and some not so wow, those who were addicted to the WOW turned to others who could give them their hits.

Those of us who are still here are here cause we're fine-tuned (brilliant) enough to get that WOW! from him without the manufacturered excitement of AI.

I don't know if that made any sense whatsoever, but maybe you get the gist????

This makes absolute sense. I also think the "whatever" factor spilled over into the sense that sheer numbers could get things done. I.E. stuff like bombarding the radio stations to get his single played, voting wherever his name shows up to keep him as high up to No. one as possible. Remember the push to get his videos played on TRL? The fans were so used to calling in their vote every week on American Idol, that it just became a habit and modus operandi to get things done. Some of it didn't work so well. :F_05BL17blowkiss:

[cindilu2]

Agree with Cindy, Luckiest, Play and Tijala; to me; the biggest problem regarding the online fandom is the lack of respect for Clay; his family and associates at times. You can disagree with something Clay has said or done or not like his background singers or how his hair is on any given day...but do it respectfully. It is the tone and choice of words that annoys me.

Kim

Yes, I'd agree with this - especially when it comes to Clay. I don't have a problem with people not liking something about him (his words, his hair, his clothes, a particular song, etc.) and stating those facts. But some of the things said are downright nasty... and these are supposed to be "fan" boards? I get that he doesn't read here and the boards are for the fans, but with some of the stuff I've read, I'm stunned these people even consider themselves fans and stick around...

And geez, I made a not nice comment about Clive once, I'm not a fan - I don't hate him either and I still feel bad about that... do not these "fans" of Clay not feel anything about being so mean?

Nope. They don't. It's invigorating and sophisticated, dontchaknow? Snark, you see.

[Couch Tomato]

Couchie, I understand the question of 'what can we do'... I just don't see it as something that is up to us to do. All of that is on Clay and Team Clay. I do understand that some people have the need to feel that they are doing 'something'. I also think however, that that need is a big part of the reason for the angst and the upset. That somehow 'we' fail.

I'm not really asking what can we do at all. I'm asking generally how do people learn about this album or any album these days, especially if they aren't online. I'm not one to try to do marketing and promotion, nor do I carry the burden of trying to sell it on my shoulders. I think most of "us" do what we can.

I do agree that bitterness has become a little ingrained... even before OMWH came out there was a lot of joy but still mixed in there was a lot of bitterness...you know..yay Clay's new album is so wonderful then on to a whole bitter diatribe about RCA and Clive etc.

I think he will tour for Xmas as well and then next year. We'll see soon enough.

Tijala, I definitely believe that no subject deserves a special hush hush place to discuss. it gives the gnats too much importance. I don't think talking about things leads to angst - this is all part and parcel of being a fan IMO. By making cubby holes and making certain things off limits it makes these things much larger than they need to be. Too much back door channels have allowed things to grow out of control. I feel we're all adults and anything should be able to be discussed. In the cold light of the day the ridiculousness of some of this stuff would have been exposed a long time ago..especially with regards to Clay having special friends on special boards and all the fake clay shennanigans. I think people needed to hear..THAT SHIT DON'T MAKE SENSE..but if it's on the QT.. that just didn't happen a lot of the times.

ETA: Cindilu, you know we don't see eye to eye on what's ok and not ok to discuss... I respect your opinion but definitely feel there are ways to have conversations about almost anything clay related. I do realize it's a tough thing to do and I realize we're lucky in that being kinda small it makes it easier. We also don't have a bunch of trolls waiting to throw in their imput.

[Jaycee]

Yes, I'd agree with this - especially when it comes to Clay. I don't have a problem with people not liking something about him (his words, his hair, his clothes, a particular song, etc.) and stating those facts. But some of the things said are downright nasty... and these are supposed to be "fan" boards? I get that he doesn't read here and the boards are for the fans, but with some of the stuff I've read, I'm stunned these people even consider themselves fans and stick around...

And geez, I made a not nice comment about Clive once, I'm not a fan - I don't hate him either and I still feel bad about that... do not these "fans" of Clay not feel anything about being so mean?

I have wondered about this so many times. I understand that we all have a right to say how we feel but it makes me wonder when I read a post (not here) and the person sounds like they really don't like him. We all have THINGS that we don't like from time to time but if you don't like the person "Clay Aiken" then why would you want to waste your time on a fan board. Still there they are and always finding fault. I don't get it.

I don't think that Clay reads any of the fan boards but we do know that he reads at the OFC and I am sure that what he has read since the baby news hasn't made him happy. It really doesn't matter if it is true or not it was the way HIS FANS reacted without having any REAL facts.

[Cotton]

Home from work.

Verra Verra Tired!!!

Last night was one of those - wake up at 2:00am then look at the clock at 2:30, 2:45, 3:05, etc.

So - I'm two pages behind.

Any news???

Is the man on safe ground yet that we know of for sure???

I love SAU. I can actually imagine Frank Sinatra singing it!

Haven't had time to really visit with it today, but I do think it will prove to be a "timeless" song!

Back to catching up!

[Iseeme]

Several thoughts....

o - I have always been glad that Clay did NOT win American Idol because I felt the way it all came about made people want to support him and make him a success. But who knows what would have been different if he had to stay at 19, etc. and didn't go his own way for management. Would it have been different with his label? Would they always be fighting over what he should record or not record? We'll never know. I do know he seems very happy with OMWH and his involvement in all aspects of it - and that's good!

o - I do feel there's a way to say a person doesn't care for something without it being nasty or mean. "Clay's hair looks like shit" versus "I really loved JBT hair better than the straight, blonde look." I really despise secret threads or hush hush places. It does give the bad guys power and you never know who's reading there. One of the board's sekrit thread during the 2006 mess is a perfect example. Someone said (and I won't divulge her name.....) that some of the people went in there just because they liked to get dirty and that was the attraction to reading that thread. I agree. It should never have been allowed.

o - Have always been kind of lukewarm about ATDW. I listen to it, but not often. I have favorite songs on it but skip more than I listen to. It was such a loooong wait and then almost anti-climactic when it came out. But I never heard Clay "hated" it. He did seem pretty pleased about singing all new music on this CD though. Of the 3, it's probably my least favorite - which is like saying I'd rather have chocolate ice cream instead of strawberry ice cream. I get ice cream either way.....(smile)

o - internet fandom versus non-internet fandom. This is a tough one. If you don't go on the internet it's kind of hard to know what's going on. But if you do go on the internet you're subjected on some boards to know-it-alls, hypersensitivity, the absolute demand for freedom of speech no matter who gets crushed in the process, constant criticism of anything Clay says or does, self-proclaimed marketing experts, self-proclaimed music experts (although I swear, I have sooo much respect for a couple of the folks on this board that can dissect a song and explain things.....I do really like reading that!) and self-proclaimed musical industry experts. Clay probably pays his team highly for their expertise and guidance and all he needs to do is read a few of the boards (snark and sarcasm with that last statement) to find out how to manage his career.

o - how DOES a CD get promoted? I also don't listen to the radio. Can't remember the last time I listened to the radio unless it was a football game. When I'm exposed to new music or a new artist it's through television. The talk shows - morning and late night. The TV news magazines. REality shows - SYTYCD, etc. People Magazine and US, etc. I sincerely hope to see Clay on my TV alot in the very near future. We still have his Paula Deen gig to look forward to for sure.

o - I know people are spending less money on "nice to haves" and I also know that downloading from the internet has cut wayyyyyyyyyyyy in to CD sales. But there are still people out there selling CDs and selling alot of CDs. Why? Who knows.

As for Clay's future? Good Lord - why would it NOT be bright? I just can't imagine someone with his talent fading into the haze never to be seen nor heard from again.

And I agree with Muski's post about kid's attitudes toward Clay. If you didn't know the truth and you believed the tabloids all the time - you WOULD think he was some kind of freak. It irritates the snot out of me when some reporter will still describe him as elfish or any of those words. He's a handsome man. Has anybody looked at Pete Wentz lately? Does anybody ever describe him as having a big head and no neck on a short body? Nope. Clay, through little fault of his own, has become the media's whipping boy! A mention of him is always good for sales or hits.

Ack - too long of a post. Sorry.

[Couch Tomato]

Forgot to add... while I think anything can be discussed...dont' really understand why every single Clay diss is brought to the boards and discussed ad naseum. Who gives a shit what Craig Ferguson has to say or some blogger with two readers before Clay Nation and the haters descended up on it. I think often times the perception of just how bad it is out there is skewed because we have to see every single thing. It's like there is heartbreak on the board every single day because of what some idiot said. No wonder the joy is sucked out of this thing that should be fun.

[Claygasm]

One problem with the boards is that one person's perception of lack of respect is another person just not loving something about or associated with Clay. I have had many people tell me I am being disresepctful toward Clay when I say I don't like his hair or his clothes or a song choice or jokingly talked about someone associated with him. There are some fans out there who love everything Clay does and think all his choices are wonderful etc. That is fine and if it makes them happy I say go for it! But they have no right to expect everyone to feel the way they do.

I agree there are some posts I have read that are down right nasty toward Clay. But they are in the minority. While I hate the hate Clive/RCA conspiracy theories, I don't think they are necessarily disrespectful to Clay as much as they are just wacko! The only disrespect I see in them is MY perception that they are painting Clay as a wimp, a victim, who can't stand up for himself.

I think we as fans are entitled (and I am sure some will jump on me for even using that word!) to say if we don't like something about Clay and his choices. He is entitled to totally ignore what we say! Who out there never tells the loved ones in your life when you are disappointed in something they do? Who out there thinks your nearest and dearest are perfect and always do everything right? You can love someone to death, think they are wonderful, enjoy being with them, never get tired of them, and still not agree with everything they say or do. Being a fan of Clay to me is no different. I am still here after all these years so obviously I like him. But I also do not think he is perfect. I think he has in the past - and will in the future - make poor choices and many mistakes. I have not always nor will I always love every song he sings. His hair has looked like crap at times and fabulous at other times. I have rolled my eyes at things he has said and cringed at others. I am sure I will again in the future. And I think I have a right to express it when he does something that I don't like.

But I am still here. I think my fandom is in a better place lately because I have put it more into perspective with my real life. But I am still here.

I like Clay despite his faults, poor choices and bad hair. Maybe its because I know that he will turn around and make excellent choices and have great hair if I hang around long enough.

He is interesting and he entertains me. Until those things change, I will be here, and I will be here expressing when I love something about him, or when I don't. And I see nothing wrong with that.

[spikesmom]

Forgot to add... while I think anything can be discussed...dont' really understand why every single Clay diss is brought to the boards and discussed ad naseum. Who gives a shit what Craig Ferguson has to say or some blogger with two readers before Clay Nation and the haters descended up on it. I think often times the perception of just how bad it is out there is skewed because we have to see every single thing. It's like there is heartbreak on the board every single day because of what some idiot said. No wonder the joy is sucked out of this thing that should be fun.

I rarely click on Clay related links any more unless I have a pretty good idea what it is and have determined it's worth it... if whatever it is is brought over so I can read it on the board and not give the site a hit, all the better and I might still read it... my skin has gotten thicker over time so I can blow most of the crap off... but I often still scroll too.... yep, the joy can easily be sucked out if you read every little thing and let it bug you...

Honestly, it has helped to hear others talk about other fandoms and the crap that gets spewed on all different people, sports, etc. I really wasn't familiar with the internet and message boards before Clay so some of it really took me by surprise... another one of the fandom school of hard knocks lessons but now it's easier for me to ignore...

[aikim]

Forgot to add... while I think anything can be discussed...dont' really understand why every single Clay diss is brought to the boards and discussed ad naseum. Who gives a shit what Craig Ferguson has to say or some blogger with two readers before Clay Nation and the haters descended up on it. I think often times the perception of just how bad it is out there is skewed because we have to see every single thing. It's like there is heartbreak on the board every single day because of what some idiot said. No wonder the joy is sucked out of this thing that should be fun.

Because there are some fans who actually enjoy preying on the fears of the fandom; they bring this things to the boards and then sit back an enjoy the mayhem that ensues. I also think there are fans working both sides of the fence...who have turned on Clay for one reason or another and even though they present themselves as true fans; they are also doing their darndest to get the fandom to implode.

You can almost set your watch by how quickly they show up when there is a controversy.

And then I think there are some who are just gluttons for punishment; who purposely go to websites or watch shows that they know are not Clay friendly just so they can come to the boards and complain about how upset they are and how mean people are to Clay.

Kim

[Lotus]

muskifest So I do believe the "young" fans are the ones who have it the roughest. Just admitting you're a Clay Aiken fan is probably a courageous decision!

2 years ago at a fan dinner at the DF Star Search I was talking with a couple from Bellingham or Seattle who had driven their Clay fan daughter to the Gala. They were telling me what a rough time their daughter was given by her peers in high school because she was such a Clay fan. Yes..for many young fans it is rough.

Jaycee I don't think that Clay reads any of the fan boards but we do know that he reads at the OFC and I am sure that what he has read since the baby news hasn't made him happy. It really doesn't matter if it is true or not it was the way HIS FANS reacted without having any REAL facts.

I really hope that TC read fan boards other than OFC. I know I wouldn't be an internet fan of Clay's if the only on-line place I could read about him was the OFC.

I have decided to come out of the cell phone stone age and get a ring tone for my phone.

Where is a good place for me to get a Clay ring tone? Anyone? I don 't know anything about how to go about it.

[Ansamcw]

Check it out!!!

Clay has the first four places on the AOL Top 11 now!!

http://music.aol.com/top11?themeName=defau...videoID=2131399

This is one of the ways people get to know about a cd...specially with kids in High school and college...AOL, Youtube, myspace, facebook...thats how my kids exchange music they love.

Couchie...I think right now internet, TV and radio are he most common ways that people learn about CD releases. I love coldplay but didn't know they had a new CD out until I saw a commercial.

Forgot to add... while I think anything can be discussed...dont' really understand why every single Clay diss is brought to the boards and discussed ad naseum. Who gives a shit what Craig Ferguson has to say or some blogger with two readers before Clay Nation and the haters descended up on it. I think often times the perception of just how bad it is out there is skewed because we have to see every single thing. It's like there is heartbreak on the board every single day because of what some idiot said. No wonder the joy is sucked out of this thing that should be fun.

So true...I think when Clay was just starting...there was a need to know to prepare us for the worse...kind of mentality. But right now we know that some people think Clay is not cool...lots of people think Clay is gay and that there are a lot of asshats blogging or running gossip sites that are trying to get hits ...so there really isn't anything new out there...

CG....I do agree with you. I think we all are entitled to our opinion and to express our opinion. I guess the line is crossed if the opinion is stated in a belittling way. I also think that there is a difference in expressing an opinion and arguing a point.

I also don't think that Clay is perfect...I think the real essence of the kind of acceptance that TRM is talking about is when someone is there to support or help you despite all these imperfections and mistake...its not thinking that he is always right or does no wrong.

SAU....In the beginning I was a bit lukewarm to this song. I think I just felt the lyrics were a bit OTT in depicting this perfect love...that I kinda want to roll my eyes...but the production and his vocals are excellent. When I think about how Clay chose this song...I get the impression that Clay is very idealistic in his idea of love...

[Iseeme]

SAU is one of those songs that I think is going to kick-ass when you see him sing it "live" but doesn't have the same visceral feeling to me when you just listen to it. I, too, think of Frank Sinatra or any of those big band singers from the past. This is almost an old-fashioned song, but I think Clay does tremendous justice to it. It has kind of that smokey room, dimmed lights touch to it. The lyrics are a bit "lyrical" (hee!) but that's what makes it a great song. Listen to some of Manilow's lyrics or any of the other allegedly great crooners who write their own music......

Aikim said:

Because there are some fans who actually enjoy preying on the fears of the fandom; they bring this things to the boards and then sit back an enjoy the mayhem that ensues. I also think there are fans working both sides of the fence...who have turned on Clay for one reason or another and even though they present themselves as true fans; they are also doing their darndest to get the fandom to implode

This is sooooo true! I honestly believe there are posters who pass themselves off as fans just to see what kind of turd they can stir! And they have a knack for stepping back into the conversation when it seems to have come to a resolution and stirring it up again! And you really can almost set your watch by their appearance in some threads.

I'm hoping Mr. Aiken is in Birmingham, Alabama tonite....getting ready to celebrate the wedding of his good friend Ruben. That would make me smile.

[playbiller]

heh, spikesmom, I meant to mention this to someone the other day - I absolutely do not click on links when someone says - Oh Look At This and puts a link out there - tell me what it is and I might click, I have had too many bad surprises.

There are different board cultures and you really have to post differently on different boards. One boards have started using snark, but over the years it has turned rather nasty as the population evolved and tried to top each other . When this is brought to a more mild mannered board, it looks positively evil. It is everything in it's context - If I went to a particularly snarky, analyzing, or bitching board, I would know what to expect. Then again there are some people who go off their meds from time to time. The PROC EZ board started out a Clay board evolved to a Clay, Bo and Constantine board and then died - there were some fun posters, there was some really funny stuff, but some not so much, it was like a few people soured the snark, others just went away.

Yes, Claygasm, I agree that one should always be able to say they don't like something - ONCE, maybe twice. I don't want to hear it every other post as I have seen a few people do. I don't think starting a post with "Clay is so stupid" helps the discussion, I have seen sentences start worse. Clay is far from stupid, yet many fans treat him that way. Then there is this is horrible he does not know what he is doing before a show - OH. MY. GOD - the angst and anger before the Jukebox tour - worst idea ever!!!!!! Fans know ALL !!! Or how horrible the JNT05 sounded but I loved it , I would have been fine with people not liking it but they had to go on and on about it being a bad idea and he didn't know how to stage a show, etc. A simple "I don't like it" and why once would have sufficed. (I like JNT05 kind of stuff, so it is easier for me to be a fan, I like watching people stretch, nothing ever has to be perfect for me to have a good time). Remember the angst from him making that big mistake Spamalot? I say wait and see and decide for yourself.

My problem with the RCA and individual vitriolic hatred was that Clay had to work with the people being attacked, had to go to meetings and probably talk about this. If, indeed, RCA had people who read message boards, do you think people would want to work with Clay, to do their best for him when they get shredded and ripped apart for it? Sure some people could do a better job, but that is Clay's job to make sure of it and, I believe, a fan's job to stay out of Clay's way. This is where I think the fandom is a blessing and a curse. It is clay's career to manage and if there are problems he should be able to work them out without unnecessary interference. Yadda yadda yadda - insert story about my friend's father who complained to her boss about how he was treating her. Told it too many times already.

[Couch Tomato]

LadyJ said it best the other day..it really is all about tone.

To me it makes no sense for there to be anger and bitterness behind the words when you're talking about hair.

[keepingfaith]

Has anybody read about, and have an opinion on, the vote in a House Judiciary Subcommittee this week that would force radio stations to pay royalties to artists and record labels? This is aimed specifically at terrestrial radio -- it's already a done deal for satellite. No doubt the National Association of Broadcasters will fight this tooth and nail when it moves to the full Judiciary Committee -- but over in the Senate, where this goes next, both the Judiciary Committee Chairman (Pat Leahy) and the opposition ranking member (Orrin Hatch) are supporting it. Maybe this is the answer to the dismal plight of the record labels. Considering everything I've heard on the Clay message boards for the last couple of years about payola, this is really through the looking glass now -- pay TO play instead of pay FOR play!

From yesterday's news:

House Subcommittee Passes Royalty Bill, NAB Girds For War On House Floor

The House Judiciary Subcommittee on Courts, the Internet and Intellectual Property met TODAY and approved a bill requiring radio stations to pay royalties to performers and record labels. The vote came while Representatives, often of the same party, were sending letters to their colleagues , advocating one side of this issue or the other.

Cue The Happy People

The MUSICFIRST COALITION's Exec. Dir. DOYLE BARTLETT was pleased with the House vote. “Subcommittee passage of H.R. 4789 is a major victory for America’s artists and musicians and a major triumph for fundamental fairness. ....

“A loophole in the law lets AM and FM music radio stations earn $16 billion a year is advertising revenue without compensating the artists and musicians who bring music to life and listeners’ ears to the radio dial, he continued. "It’s not right, it’s not fair and we are going to make sure it is changed. All other music platforms – satellite radio, Internet webcasts, and cable television music stations – pay artists and musicians to use their music. It’s only fair that terrestrial radio be held to the same standards."

Sen. PATRICK LEAHY (D-VT), Chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, which will take up the bill next, gave it his full endorsement: "Members of the House Judiciary Committee today took the first steps in moving forward legislation to provide fair performance rights to artists. Since I joined with Sen. HATCH and our friends in the House last year to introduce performance rights legislation, I have heard from both performers and local radio stations about this legislation. The House Subcommittee’s mark today has continued the debate on how best to protect the rights of performers and songwriters, and the needs of noncommercial and small commercial radio stations .... I hope the Judiciary Committee might be able to turn its attention to this issue before the end of the year."

[Iseeme]

Hadn't read about that kf. That would certainly shake up the broadcasting community. BUT.......it might give the listeners more voice in what is played and less would be up to who was paying the radio stations (if that's true) to be heard. Listeners might really have some influence. That would be a good thing! But I bet the broadcasting companys fight this to the hilt.

[HeidiHo]

I have been thinking about all of this for awhile... I guess since the CD came out and didn't sell like most of us, I think, expected. How DO you get the word out to those people that might be interested in Clay's kind of music, that he has something new? How would someone reach me? <snip for brevity>

I don’t think that how someone finds out about music is easy to categorize. Some people do watch a lot of TV, some listen to the radio, some surf the net….it’s hard to pin down. I’m not really too worried about it right now.

What I am wondering about though is what has happened to the fans that bought 211,000 copies of ATDW in the first week. This was a CD that fans were not excited about, they bought it because it was Clay and bought maybe 1 or 2 copies instead of the 7 that they would have bought! <g> So figuring 2 a piece that is 100,000 fans that ran out the first week. Where did they go? <snip for brevity>

Well, I’d say 90% of buyers are not on the net as hardcore fans (I see people make this mistake all the time, and did as far back as the beginning of the X-Files) – I don’t think that the hardcore internet fandom is bigger than 10k people (and that’s being generous), and not all of them are going to buy 2 or 7 CDs. That means there are quite a few casual fans who are more likely to drift in and out, who aren’t paying as close attention as we are – and who are much more affected by a shortened promotional window. HOWEVER, it’s not just Clay. People just aren’t buy albums the way they used to – I think it’s safe to say that’s fact.

Do any of you know people that have left the fandom since ATDW came out? I know that through the years people have left for many different reasons but it seemed strange to me that fans that didn't leave during the mess, have left since and I don't understand why. How do you get them back?<snip>

People leave EVERY fandom. Every single one. It just happens – people get bored for a variety of reasons that just aren’t that simple to pin down. I was a hard core XF fan and was on the net when the net was actually a much harsher place (in terms of boards) – most people who post on Clay message boards could NEVER stomach usenet (made TWOP look like a cake walk). Anyone else here visit alt.tv groups? Ick. I was a huge Duchovny fan and went from usenet, to a big public XF board, to a smaller DD board, to a private email list – that is the nature of the beast. You slowly whittle down to where you are with people of a mostly like mind (no one is ever in 100% agreement). When the show ended, I eventually stopped all things DD – got bored with nothing to watch. Now, I watch Californication, and love the man to pieces – but the odds of me being first in line at the theater on the opening day of the XF movie aren’t that high. People change, become fans of new people, real life takes over (that’s definitely impacted my posting on the net – and I’ve always been a one-board woman anyway) – shit happens.

This has turned out to be long.. sorry! I am not around a lot so I don't have much chance to join in. I end up doing it all at once.

Dude, I am the queen of the super long post. Don’t worry about it. I usually only visit once a day, so that’s the way it goes. People will/can scroll or not.

I don't think you can accurately compare figures from 2006 to 2008, because the industry is changing. People are buying less and less CDs each year, whether it be because of the economy, or advancing technology, or the ease of downloading things for free. Take your pick. Sure, I would have loved to see OMWH sell more right out of the gate, but I don't think that it sold poorly. And depending on what Clay has up his sleeve for the next little while, it could pick up again. Who knows?

Yeah, I agree with all that. It’s no different than trying to compare MOAM with ATDW. Industry is still in flux. And I don’t think there’s much question that the US economy is going into the shitter. I know too many people that are having a hard time making ends meet. When you have to spend $100 putting gas in the tank once or twice a month will you have money left for CDs?

Thanks for the welcome!! <g> I don't mind being disagreed with at all.

Well thank Jesus for that! <g> Because it’s bound to happen sooner or later. I don’t know that I’m disagreeing so much, in this instance, as offering an alternative view of the situation.

I was only comparing the 2 CD's because there was a lot more excitment for OMWH then for ATDW and normally that would have been translated into more sales, not less. I know that the economy is different and maybe that is really what it is all about. We saw what Lil Wayne sold a couple weeks ago. His fans are the age group that I would normally think are getting free downloads and file sharing but they seemed to go out and buy the CD's.

But you’re using what you see on the net as a barometer for the “excitement” – the internet fans are a very small number of highly invested people, therefore not a good indicator. The XF fans used to do this all the time – they actually got pissed when XF became popular in the mainstream because they were no longer the “cool” ones. They would rant and rave about inconsistencies in an episode and about Chris Carter and couldn’t figure out why the ratings were still high. Ah, the good old days. <g>

I don't want to be totally negitive, I just love Clay a whole lot and want him to be very successful and around for a long time.

I don’t think being worried and being negative are the same thing. I can tell you’re worried, and I wouldn’t worry about being negative – it happens. It’s when it’s your whole life that it’s a problem. And I would advise avoiding those boards. <g>

And geez, I made a not nice comment about Clive once, I'm not a fan - I don't hate him either and I still feel bad about that... do not these "fans" of Clay not feel anything about being so mean?

Nope. They don't. It's invigorating and sophisticated, dontchaknow? Snark, you see.

You forgot the part where “critical thinking” equals saying critical things. That one always bugged me. I’m a scientist – I don’t think “critical thinking” means what you think it means (tm Inigo Montoya). Heh.

One problem with the boards is that one person's perception of lack of respect is another person just not loving something about or associated with Clay. I have had many people tell me I am being disresepctful toward Clay when I say I don't like his hair or his clothes or a song choice or jokingly talked about someone associated with him. There are some fans out there who love everything Clay does and think all his choices are wonderful etc. That is fine and if it makes them happy I say go for it! But they have no right to expect everyone to feel the way they do.

You know you and I are in agreement on the point about not loving every single thing and being able to express that. I HAVE said his hair looks like shit before because it HAS. <g> If the word “shit” is the problem – well, too bad. Don’t take away my words (tm David Duchovny). People on both sides of a conversation have to, IMO, accept that people will disagree with them, sometimes strongly. And realize that disagreement does not equal an attack. Other than the hair, I generally don’t criticize the man much because he doesn’t seem to do much that I can’t find a logical explanation for or that I don’t like. I do accept that others won’t always be that way, but I WILL vocalize my disagreement with their views when it happens. That’s a message board for you.

KF, you keep posting about in depth politics, I really will have to marry you. <g>

[playbiller]

How would this give listeners more power? Wouldn't it encourage radio to make bulk deals and still play only a few songs/

On a positve,, sort of , front, I got a listeners survey from one of the many sttions I subscribe to rate the music and got to rate their entire playlist and comment oh how if they don't have more variety I would not be listening much longer and to ask just how Daughtry was AC, heh.

[HeidiHo]

Ooops. See what happens when you're in a hurry.

[HeidiHo]

How would this give listeners more power? Wouldn't it encourage radio to make bulk deals and still play only a few songs/

On a positve,, sort of , front, I got a listeners survey from one of the many sttions I subscribe to rate the music and got to rate their entire playlist and comment oh how if they don't have more variety I would not be listening much longer and to ask just how Daughtry was AC, heh.

I can see where if they actually have to pay to play songs they might be more inclined to make sure they are picking songs people actually like, as opposed to just taking money from labels.

Okay, now that I verbalize that thought I'm not sure about it. It just seems that if you have to buy something, you're going to want to make sure that it's something people like. Therefore, they *should* be more inclined to listen to requests. HOWEVER, that requires that DJs get over their own biases and accept that maybe people like Clay really are popular and it's not just one wacked out person emailing ever ten seconds.

[Iseeme]

Play, what I was thinking when I said that was people could use their "buying power" with advertisers to request the music they want to hear.