#46: Avoid the crazy, enjoy the good, and chill.

[Jaycee]

Jaycee, the distinction I see is that the Billboards made fun of people. The jokes were about putting people down. It was also homophobic. It was also on TV at a time when children could watch it.

The French Taunters are just being silly and mocking themselves. Monty Python is, to generalize, guy humor. The cast is almost all men. I'm pretty modest and I laughed and thought it was funny. I think they even tried to make each other laugh. Plus they warn parents that it's not appropriate for children under a certain age. If fans went there and were offended it's their own problem as they were warned.

TV and Broadway, very different things.

I won't try to convince you but I was shocked at Pink humping something or someone in prime time. MP I expected it to be very silly. That's what it's all about. My husband saw it three times and loved it. I think it gave him a lot more respect for Clay, who did a fantastic job.

FearofH2O You're right and each thing that has bothered me is probably just as silly as this, it was just a build up I guess.

A lot of you have said that Clay hasn't changed. That may very well be true but I guess I wasn't seeing the real Clay, so to me he seems to have changed a lot. Doesn't mean there is anything wrong with this one, it just means that he is different then I thought he was. I will just have to deal with it, or not, but I do thank all of you for allowing me to get it out, it has helped.

[Scarlett]

One of the great things I learned when working in Japan was not to say "The Japanese" are anything, do anything, etc. Because it wouldn't be true. Just putting 99% in there doesn't change that.

Somehow the experience in two schools seems to have been extrapolated to "Asians".

My first week of working in the office in Japan - software and testing engineers - swept all of my preconceived notions away. Some people were brilliant, some smart, some dumb as posts, some lazy, some over-achievers.

Just like in America.

I do think Kimiye's experience as an actual Asian might give her a bit of insight.

Taking the discussion back to Clay, I love how he takes the time to be very specific while discussing his interactions with many cultures, naming not just the country but often specifying the exact town he visited. Even one country isn't homogenous; some people from the Aceh area don't even like being called Indonesian.. but that's another story. Getting back to Clay, he also seemed very respectful in the way he talked about his Canal Street experience to Jimmy Kimmel. Even while trying to be funny, he spoke about hearing people speaking Mandarin and Cantonese not "Chinese" nor "some Asian language". These are teeny, tiny things but I think they show at least as much about who he is as some random snapshot displayed w/o context -- not that I don't appreciate viewing pictures. *blows a thank you kiss to those who brought them*

Also wanted to say how much I appreciate the points of view presented by our by our new members - clayzycoffin, tribeca and calurker. Thanks for joining/de-lurking this year. *wipes forehead after being extra-careful on the points of view part -- sheesh!* Many of us oldies know when to put on our flak jackets and we often prove ourselves right in exercising this caution, but it's refreshing to see newbies go into these discussions with fresh minds. Right after People magazine was released, the OFC thread got too caught up with who was right and who was wrong that people lost sight of what was right and wrong.

I do want to put in my two cents on the Asian discussion because I grew up there and I was able to travel a lot in the region because of my Dad's job. I agree about education - quite a number of people I've met value education very highly. In my own family, my parents had been dead set on my attending an all-girls Catholic school from Kindergarten to Finishing school *still shudders in horror at the memory* and would not be swayed by any arguments. However when an "educational opportunity" came up, they gave in just like that. Many Asian parents welcome and maximize educational opportunities for their children. Others don't. I've had an aunt tell me specifically, "Don't get too smart. The boys will be scared of you." And that line in the movie Titanic about how girls only go to the university to find husbands? Heard that a lot too. Oh, and the benefits of extra schooling depends on the other side as well -- the children need to appreciate what is being given them for it to work. I didn't go the tutoring route but some of my children's non-Asian classmates received extra help after class and some benefited greatly while others just tried to avoid what they viewed as "detention".

I disagree that the majority of Asians received or paid for extra tutoring for school children. In many countries, most people live under the poverty line and can barely earn enough to feed their families let alone send them to school. Also speech patterns differ throughout the region just like here in America with some people having trouble with f/p or b/p or l/r (the opposite of r/l), etc. so I don't think this part holds true either:

Clack : I only recently found out what Clack was derived from, although I kinda worked it out (as Randy would say).

LOL you know how Asians (mainly oriental asians) can't pronounce their "R"s, so it could be dangerous if you are in South East Asia talking about 'clack', non-Claysians may give you strange looks!. ... ROFL!!!

ETA: Remember how Clay said at the "Talk-back" event that the other role he would have wanted was Tom Deckman's? Most people's minds went to the Herbert scene but play (I think) and I immediately went straight into a discussion of how he would do the French Taunter scene!

[Lotus]

Off topic I know and since it is such a momentous time I hope it is allright that I post this here instead of the political thread.

I just finished watching the address that President-Elect Obama gave before thousands of people in Baltimore. How wonderful it will be to have as President of the U.S. someone who is so inspiring, so articulate, someone who can fill people's hearts with hope in these times which are difficult for so many people.

[muskifest]

Well, personally I'm not sure there's much of a change in the Clay who sat in a public restaurant BEFORE we knew who he was and wore a white chef's hat with 'Even my hand rejects me" on it, next to a friend with "I go both ways" and another friend with "I swallow" on their hats. (Where the hell IS that pic? Is that what the hats said?)...

I was reading something recently (nevermindwhat heh) in which a gay man was 'advising' a younger man who had just come to terms with his own homosexuality. He was telling the young guy about the ways in which he should 'be careful' in public. Things like "when your mom asks if you've been dating any special girl, be careful with the pronouns in your answer" and "when your male friends start making gay jokes or slurs, try to steer the conversation elsewhere or, if you feel confident with those friends, suggest that that kind of talk really isn't good, etc." This man went on to tell the young man about safe sex and how there's never a reason NOT to use a condom whenever he decides to hook up with someone. He also told the young man that until he was comfortable with everyone knowing his sexual orientation, he needed to make sure that his family and close friends couldn't see any real difference in his behavior....

...since he was from a Southern Baptist upbringing and around people who for generations were not exactly tolerant and accepting of homosexuals and other 'different' groups from what they considered themselves to be---the moral, upstanding, Bible-and-God-fearing "righteous" population.

!!!!

Wow. Now this particular example was NOT about Clay Aiken, but it could have been. And it made me think of all those years that Clay must've known about these 'rules', even if he had nobody to talk with about them. And how living that way---"always on parade" "will this glass house break" must have aged and matured him way beyond his chronological years. He says Kim Locke was the first person he came out to. He was 24 years old then. How he must have struggled to be 'himself' and still be the "man" those he loved so much thought he was and expected him to be.

Maybe that's why it seems that some fans seem happier with 'this' Clay---not because we like him 'better' when he's all silly and campy and whatnot or because we approve or encourage anything, but because of the fact that he's free to be silly and campy and whatnot without feeling that he has to hide while doing it. And, at least for me, because it means that he has other people to talk with, to listen to, to learn from, to confide in about things without being condemned for who he is. Things that for 24 years he couldn't share with anyone.

ETA: I'd like at this time to beg the admins to please bring back that whistling emoticon to the main panel over there to the left. I use it a lot and now can never find it! And as we all know, it's all about MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

[Lotus]

[Thankful4Clay]

Here it is, Muski. I love his sense of humor.

[muskifest]

Thanks, Thankful! And I just noticed something in that pic that I hadn't noticed before. The girl with the "I swallow" hat is wearing a necklace with a CROSS!

BWAH!

Just shows to go ya', you know?

[merryclay]

The thing that really filled me with hope for our land was the miracle of that plane landing and the pure truth that the pilot doing a superb job got a great result. What a great sign to the everyday man. The fact that other people working together were the second part of the miracle. I believe that pilot was a honest, hard working man all his life, and he took his responsibility so seriously that failure wasn't an option. Maybe God is trying to tell us something because that was a miracle in my eyes.

[cindilu2]

muski, whistling dude is in the second panel (if you click 'next') of the clickables. I'm sorry, I don't know how to make him move to the first page - it seems to be random!

I love this pic. Told me all I ever needed to know about the Aiken sense of humor. He's fun guy!

[bottlecap]

Doesn't mean there is anything wrong with this one, it just means that he is different then I thought he was.

Yeah, was this the theme for 2008 or what? "I'm doing Spamalot on Broadway; and by the way, I'm having a baby with Jaymes; and oh yeah, I'm gay; and now that that's out of the way, have you seen how hawt my boyfriend is?" It was a lot to process, and I'm personally glad all that news kind of got parceled out in bite-sized bits - otherwise I would have had a harder time with all the changes. And it does help to vent and chew over your thoughts and feelings, whether it's online or with your Clay friends in person. (Waves to laughn.)

I've been thinking all day about the subject of expecting Clay to behave a certain way. As much as fans think we "know" about the man, we really don't know HIM. I see much of Clay's personal life as being a blank screen, with fans projecting their own ideas and images on it. I know in my own case, I project my own behaviors and likes and dislikes up on to that screen. For example, I don't drink in real life (partly for religious reasons and partly from having had family issues with alcoholics), so I tend extrapolate from what Clay said in LTS to mean he still feels the exact same way. If a another poster seems to take joy in pointing out that Clay looks buzzed in a certain picture, it automatically puts my back up because that's not how the movie I have in my head of how Clay is plays out. So much is open to interpretation. Different perceptions from different scriptwriters and different directors. Neither right or wrong - just different and allowances should be made for that. YMMV and all that jazz.

It's easier for me to stick with posting pictures, you know?

[justclay12]

Well, personally I'm not sure there's much of a change in the Clay who sat in a public restaurant BEFORE we knew who he was and wore a white chef's hat with 'Even my hand rejects me" on it, next to a friend with "I go both ways" and another friend with "I swallow" on their hats. (Where the hell IS that pic? Is that what the hats said?)...

I was reading something recently (nevermindwhat heh) in which a gay man was 'advising' a younger man who had just come to terms with his own homosexuality. He was telling the young guy about the ways in which he should 'be careful' in public. Things like "when your mom asks if you've been dating any special girl, be careful with the pronouns in your answer" and "when your male friends start making gay jokes or slurs, try to steer the conversation elsewhere or, if you feel confident with those friends, suggest that that kind of talk really isn't good, etc." This man went on to tell the young man about safe sex and how there's never a reason NOT to use a condom whenever he decides to hook up with someone. He also told the young man that until he was comfortable with everyone knowing his sexual orientation, he needed to make sure that his family and close friends couldn't see any real difference in his behavior....

...since he was from a Southern Baptist upbringing and around people who for generations were not exactly tolerant and accepting of homosexuals and other 'different' groups from what they considered themselves to be---the moral, upstanding, Bible-and-God-fearing "righteous" population.

!!!!

Wow. Now this particular example was NOT about Clay Aiken, but it could have been. And it made me think of all those years that Clay must've known about these 'rules', even if he had nobody to talk with about them. And how living that way---"always on parade" "will this glass house break" must have aged and matured him way beyond his chronological years. He says Kim Locke was the first person he came out to. He was 24 years old then. How he must have struggled to be 'himself' and still be the "man" those he loved so much thought he was and expected him to be.

Maybe that's why it seems that some fans seem happier with 'this' Clay---not because we like him 'better' when he's all silly and campy and whatnot or because we approve or encourage anything, but because of the fact that he's free to be silly and campy and whatnot without feeling that he has to hide while doing it. And, at least for me, because it means that he has other people to talk with, to listen to, to learn from, to confide in about things without being condemned for who he is. Things that for 24 years he couldn't share with anyone.

ETA: I'd like at this time to beg the admins to please bring back that whistling emoticon to the main panel over there to the left. I use it a lot and now can never find it! And as we all know, it's all about MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

Muski, that was a great post. I agreed with you right up until the end because it's actually all about me.

And me myb, if I saw Clay walking naked down the street, I wouldn't be thinking of nuthin. Wouldn't be conscious very long either. Surprised you passed that one up muski.

[HeidiHo]

Pictures? Impossible to know what's going on if we're not there. I'm NEVER there. I'm just grateful as hell to get some candid shots that give us a glimpse of Clay having fun with friends.

Goody-goody Clay. I would never have been here in the first place if THAT's the image I had of him. I always assumed that Clay kept a public and a private profile because he didn't want pictures of his drinking, carousing influencing young fans. That seems totally responsible to me.

Not two-faced. Mature and sensible.

I’ve never seen him as a goody goody either. Seems quite naughty a lot of the time, when there is less chance of kids seeing. <g> It’s not two faced to present a different side of yourself based on the age of an audience. Don’t parents try to avoid swearing in front of their children? Set an example? Clay may have a naughty side (thank god), but he’s also been very sensitive to children and any influence him might have.

Religious Clay? Totally and completely his business. I have never observed that religion and morality/goodness were in any way related. I've known just as many good heathens as good church/synogogue/mosque goers.

Yep, and I’ve know just as many people who I consider to be just plain awful who were very religious.

FYII loved seeing the latest seagull pictures. I think for some fans it is still hard to acknowledge that gay Clay is a sexual being.

Was there something sexual about that picture? I don’t think anyone can actually make that claim based on where someone’s arm happens to be when the shutter clicked. Now, if it was his HAND instead of his arm….well. <g> That said – I love the picture and wish I was that guys arm. <g>

I do think that statements like those above are also generalizations that are often not fair. Yes, Lotus said “some”, but I am seeing more and more of this lately (which is why I did a paragraph break, so as to not make it about Lotus’s comment specifically) – if anyone expresses anything other than pleasure at something Clay says/does/wears/etc now they must have a problem with some aspect of his being gay. How is that a “better” generalization than those made about gay people? Or those made about Asians (referencing another conversation)? Saying someone has a problem with him being gay is just an easy way, IMO, to dismiss other peoples opinions and blatantly unfair. Sometimes it might be true, but sometimes it’s not. Nothing is ever that simple. I just think we should at least try to be careful about making that jump.

If you can correlate those two events, then I don't think there's any way Clay can continue to live up to your expectations/standards.

I feel that’s unnecessarily harsh, but relatively accurate. I think Jaycee has a right to her opinion, but there is no correlation between the two things. For one thing, The Billboard Awards are televised, in primetime when children are watching, and half the people there were drunk off their asses. Two very key points that can’t be said about Spamalot. Someone else mentioned the mean-ness of the events – also can’t be applied to Spamalot. The Spamalot audience goes into the theater *knowing* that there are aspects of it that are not for children. I’d be willing to bet that Clay’s concern about his mother was more about HIM than it was about her – as a young guy he might not have an issue with seeing it, but seeing it with is mother sitting NEXT to him? A whole different story. He was likely embarrassed. Is he still embarrassed for her to see some thing like Spam six years later? I kinda doubt it, but we’ll never know. He probably prepared her (and himself). But I still think that much of Clay’s reaction to things is more related to the impact it has on *children* than it is to his own personal feelings.

Off topic I know and since it is such a momentous time I hope it is allright that I post this here instead of the political thread.

I just finished watching the address that President-Elect Obama gave before thousands of people in Baltimore. How wonderful it will be to have as President of the U.S. someone who is so inspiring, so articulate, someone who can fill people's hearts with hope in these times which are difficult for so many people.

Me too, and amen.

[merryclay]

May God lead, guide and direct this new administration. So many people's lives are depending on it, just like the plane landing.

[Carolina Clay]

Hello, FCA!

I gave up basketball today -- quite a biggie for me -- to watch the inaugural activities and write a blog about them. I led with the "Something About Us" montage; so, fortunately, Google is catching the Clay Aiken link.

There's another montage, based on fact, that will make you laugh: No One As Irish as Barack Obama. Hope you enjoy: Carolina On My Mind.

I agree, Lotus, this is a very exciting and momentous time. There were people interviewed on the mall from just about every state, as well as several foreign countries. I am enjoying the hoopla from my den.

Off topic I know and since it is such a momentous time I hope it is allright that I post this here instead of the political thread.

I just finished watching the address that President-Elect Obama gave before thousands of people in Baltimore. How wonderful it will be to have as President of the U.S. someone who is so inspiring, so articulate, someone who can fill people's hearts with hope in these times which are difficult for so many people.

May God lead, guide and direct this new administration. So many people's lives are depending on it, just like the plane landing.

WORD, merryclay!

Have a great evening, all!

Caro

[tribeca]

I wanted to tell you guys

today in the mail was my niece's Clay Spamalot poster.

Instead of being signed by just Clay the whole cast signed it

BUT

Clay's signature is way up at the top alone

and everyone else is way at the bottom

[duckyvee]

Very cool. tribeca!

[Jaycee]

If you can correlate those two events, then I don't think there's any way Clay can continue to live up to your expectations/standards.

I feel that’s unnecessarily harsh, but relatively accurate. I think Jaycee has a right to her opinion, but there is no correlation between the two things. For one thing, The Billboard Awards are televised, in primetime when children are watching, and half the people there were drunk off their asses. Two very key points that can’t be said about Spamalot. Someone else mentioned the mean-ness of the events – also can’t be applied to Spamalot. The Spamalot audience goes into the theater *knowing* that there are aspects of it that are not for children. I’d be willing to bet that Clay’s concern about his mother was more about HIM than it was about her – as a young guy he might not have an issue with seeing it, but seeing it with is mother sitting NEXT to him? A whole different story. He was likely embarrassed. Is he still embarrassed for her to see some thing like Spam six years later? I kinda doubt it, but we’ll never know. He probably prepared her (and himself). But I still think that much of Clay’s reaction to things is more related to the impact it has on *children* than it is to his own personal feelings.

In regard to what cindilu2 said, I don't really have any expectations for Clay to live up to now.

The explaination of the differences in the 2 events does make sense.

It seems I have always been naive where Clay is concerned (not anymore) I just took everything he said as being how he felt, not just how he felt in a certain situation, unless he actually said that.

When he talked of being a role model, I really thought that extended into his private life as well as his public. I thought he had high standards for himself. Of course I managed to overlook a lot of things. The picture of Clay and his 2 friends that is posted above, someone said back when it originally showed up, that the writing was put on after the picture was taken and wasn't there when they posed for it. I accepted that as fact (naive) but looking at the picture now I don't think that could be true.

I wanted to tell you guys

today in the mail was my niece's Clay Spamalot poster.

Instead of being signed by just Clay the whole cast signed it

BUT

Clay's signature is way up at the top alone

and everyone else is way at the bottom

That is very neat, I am so happy for your niece.

[Thankful4Clay]

I wanted to tell you guys

today in the mail was my niece's Clay Spamalot poster.

Instead of being signed by just Clay the whole cast signed it

BUT

Clay's signature is way up at the top alone

and everyone else is way at the bottom

That is wonderful. I hope she has it framed.

[tribeca]

HeidiHo

thanks for explaining that better than I did (I did try though)

Ducky

she is going to be so happy. We went to Spamalot twice and both times Clay didn't do the SD. So my niece (who is 12 & not at all shy) asked someone who worked at the theatre if he could get Clay to sign her poster. I told her if he said no she just had to accept it. So she want up to him and said "Can you get Clay Aiken to sign this for me? This is the third time (second really but who's counting) I have come here and he didn't do the SD every time I have been here" the man said "I could get fired if I take you back there" My niece said "no I just want his autograph". The man went backstage and asked us to wait. He came back & asked us to come back with him. Niece got very excited. When in the hallway he said "i don't do this for everyone but if you give me your address I will get your poster signed." Niece said "thank you because I can't afford to come back here again"

Jaycee

I never saw that picture before today. I thought I have seen every picture of Clay.

I too have discovered things I thought were photo shopped weren't so you are not alone on that

[annabear]

I wanted to tell you guys

today in the mail was my niece's Clay Spamalot poster.

Instead of being signed by just Clay the whole cast signed it

BUT

Clay's signature is way up at the top alone

and everyone else is way at the bottom

That is so cool! :nana:

Jaycee, thank you for sharing your thoughts & feelings today. If I were to guess, I'd say that a lot of other fans have felt similarly to you at different points over the past 5-6 years. Everyone has their own filters and experiences, as bottle pointed out, that create their own version of Clay Aiken in their minds. Then something is said or done that doesn't fit that version and people have to readjust.

To say he's been through a lot since AI2 is an understatement and, of course, he's going to have changed in some ways, but I think the essence of Clay is still exactly the same.

[Clayzy]

Tribeca--that's awesome! I'm very jealous. *green*

I can't help but keep thinking of that story in LTS that Clay told about the guy he built up in his mind to be great? (I forgot his name... I'm bad...) If you only expect your version of the best from someone, they're bound to disappoint you for one reason or another, not the least of which is that their version of the best of themselves is probably different from yours. I'm not attacking you, Jaycee, but I hope you can reconcile both images of Clay in your mind. I think when Clay is at his very best (Unicef work, BAF, Broadway Cares, The Waiting List, etc.) he is a very, very good role model, and even when he is just goofing off with friends doing things for fun or for pay, I suppose (wearing chef's hats, bow ties , Spamalot French Taunters) he is still a better role model than a large chunk of famous people out there.

If the worst thing that Clay can do is participate in bawdy comedy and pose funny for private pictures with/for friends, then, personally, I can more than live with that. Because he's a man, a man who does very good things, but also a man who takes time for the silly.

When he talked of being a role model, I really thought that extended into his private life as well as his public. I thought he had high standards for himself.

I think it extends to his private life as much as possible. I mean, Clay Aiken (as far as I've heard) doesn't smoke or go out clubbing and get hammered. In my opinion, that's a part of his personal life I would very much like to see my kids (if I had any ) emulate. His private life is private, or as much as it can be in our "I'M A FAN, THEREFORE I HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW EVERYTHING ABOUT YOU" culture. What small snippets we do see--honestly, I've never seen anything that bad about them. He wore the chef's hat before he was famous, before he could have imagined the lens his life would be under. If he had never been on American Idol, the person who put the picture on the net probably never would have dug it out--unless they were all sitting around going, "remember the day we wore those hats...?" He's a young human male, he'll do some stupid stuff, but he'll always be Clay and that's what's really important, right?

*sheepishly hops off the soapbox and slinks away*

ETA: KAndre = :laught31:

[KAndre]

KAndre sleepily opens one eye....looks around...sees a couple of new things and prepares to toss her considerably biased opinion in the mix. Because she can...

Hey Jaycee! I do see where you're coming from (and BTW, you've been doing it in a nice way). I have to agree with you - I think the public persona of Clay has changed/evolved since 2003...away from a sweet, almost-too-good-to-be-true kid to a more "regular guy"...and I do think that most of the fans currently posting do like the changes. I liked the early Clay a lot...but seem to have more in common with "regular guy" Clay (because sweet and almost-too-good-to-be true definitely ain't me) - but there's nothing wrong with missing early Clay.

Stereotyping, Asians, education and statistics? Oh man. A discussion of various cultural attitudes might be interesting though fraught with peril...I will say that applying statistics to personal anecdotes and extrapolating them to an extremely non-homogeneous group like "Asians" (which in the States includes everything from the Japanese Ainu to the Brahmins of India to the Mongols to the Filipinos) is really iffy.

Did anyone actually explain the RCA brouhaha? Shall I do it in my own special (and not particularly accurate but potentially entertaining) way? Oh, why the hell not!

At the end of Season 2, Clay who was still partially represented by Satan's spawn on earth 19-whatever-the-hell-letter-was-active-this-week, was signed to Old Nick himself, otherwise known as Clive Davis, who assigned Clay a part-time hell-hound with a really bad perm Roger something-Polish-looking. Roger hated Clay because the orgasm shampoo clearly worked to control Clay's glorious locks, but for a while Roger was willing to talk to some of Clay's fans before he found out how crazy they were. When the Clay fans couldn't hide the crazy anymore, Roger fled for his life or at least stopped talking to them, which gave the boards room to speculate like the untamed wenches they were. At some point, the speculation included that Clay somehow bitch-slapped Clive Davis and didn't go his party and then Clive made a pact with Beelzebub to destroy Clay after Clay finished 5 albums for RCA. And then RCA tried to make Claymates buy other people's records using some sort of bait-and-switch. And then some noisy wenches declared that they had inside info that Clay was all done with RCA, and people believed them - or at least until another album cam out under the RCA label. All I know is when I told Clay I asked one of his people if Clive Davis was evil incarnate, he just laughed his ass off. And that was back in '06 and he's been with RCA ever since.

This post is full of grammar and spelling and stuff. In case you didn't know.

[tribeca]

ThankfulClay

good idea we should get it framed

Clazycoffin

don't be to jealous Although my niece will be so happy with the poster she didn't met him. The first time she was so upset & tried not to cry on the way home. This time I told her I wasn't sure he will do SD. That's why she was looking on this site that day. She was checking to see if he did SD that weekend. He did every time except the show we went too. Which she told me is prove that her life is just not fair.

[justclay12]

Clayzycoffin, I am so very glad you found this board. I love your posts and you are very wise. And you can get on your soapbox anytime.

[merrieeee]

All I know is when I told Clay I asked one of his people if Clive Davis was evil incarnate, he just laughed his ass off.

Yes and we have a video to prove it. Don't we?